savrdce@auburn.edu: Little one go.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: yeah she she see if she gets like tired of me, being in here and then she'll come in and be like she wants to really be on the video screen.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: She really wants to.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Be front and Center she just wants to learn something about quotations Paleo.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: There was um for the Northeast section, there was um.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: I think it's in Connecticut dinosaur national.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: Not there's like a national dinosaur museum.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: And they did this really cool field trip, and it was on a set it was on the weekend, so I made my kids sit with me we watched it and it was really fun so yeah.
John Fronimos: Does that dinosaurs state park with the footprints.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: that's what it was yes.
John Fronimos: And that's in Connecticut right and take classes up there yeah.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: yeah yeah they've been closed and so.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: A lot of things were a little different and they're kind of redoing a lot of different things, because they can right now with people not being there but they did a great job and they'd live stream did and have videos and they were like down crawling around and so it's really cool.
Michael Thonis: yeah there's there's one of those in Connecticut and one of those Massachusetts both of them are in the well the hartford and the deerfield basins, those are the.
Michael Thonis: Those are the the rift basins.
Michael Thonis: mesozoic.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Are they triassic or Jurassic.
Michael Thonis: triassic I think 204 well I think yeah.
John Fronimos: Thanks some of the track ways, or just up into the Jurassic.
Michael Thonis: yeah I might be.
Michael Thonis: that's why I hesitated but what's interesting is that there have been up there and he's been virtually no.
Michael Thonis: almost no fossil bones found dinosaur bones found it's almost the entire there have been fossil fish found, but there are virtually it's almost entirely footprints.
Michael Thonis: And there and they're in Massachusetts Massachusetts they're everywhere, you can go to the park, but you don't really need to.
Michael Thonis: Because you can just walk out in the woods wherever you find it out crap there's footprints all over it.
Michael Thonis: it's really astonishing and yet very few skeletal remains.
Michael Thonis: And there's all kinds of theories about why you know why, why not.
Michael Thonis: The museum is i'm with them i'm a trustee with museum of science in Boston and we.
Michael Thonis: We, along with the state as a contest to two different species of dinosaur fossils that have been farewell footprints then a couple of pounds.
Michael Thonis: Fossil bones, and we just just a month ago there was a contest and it was one of the most popular museum events ever it was to get people to name to choose which of the two.
Michael Thonis: Which are the two dinosaurs would be the state dinosaur.
Michael Thonis: And they were both cool they're both cool dinosaurs are small, but.
Michael Thonis: You know.
Very.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Well, we have only 12 hey Scott there you're you're on the moon.
savrdce@auburn.edu: up here.
savrdce@auburn.edu: you're muted.
Michael Thonis: Well, you can't hear anything on the moon.
Saying.
Scott Brande: hey look i'm a bit older than you so I figured 230,000 miles is efficient social distance in order.
savrdce@auburn.edu: All right, well, it looks like we only have 12 out of the 53 attendees and I know at least a few of them told me they had.
savrdce@auburn.edu: convene other sessions and that sort of thing, so I guess, we can get started, what I wanted what I wanted to do, though, before we actually to the Q amp a for the field trip is to acknowledge our sponsors.
savrdce@auburn.edu: know a number of us were several hats for this meeting, and as as the sponsorship chair, I wanted to personally thank.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The various sponsors for the meeting, and there are a number of corporate sponsors focused material southern company since Tara and Bob fossa comes with Fo sick mineral resources, incorporated and then of course we had excuse me, local support from our own department.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Not only all the work that all the Faculty and students are doing, but some financial support for the meeting.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Also, our college of science and mathematics here at auburn thank Dean Giordano, for his support and then we have a number of other.
savrdce@auburn.edu: alumni and friends that are part of our auburn university geosciences advisory board that should be acknowledged for their their support as well, I also want to thank everybody.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Who.
savrdce@auburn.edu: put together sessions and led sessions, but also everybody who's participated in the in the meetings for those who attended.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The meeting in the folks at GSA because I think they've they're handling this covert crisis.
savrdce@auburn.edu: In a an incredible way and appreciate every everything they've done to help us get this rolling anyway i'll stop sharing the screen for now.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And we can go ahead and and get started with our Q amp a hopefully everybody listening in received my email, I think I sent it on Wednesday evening, just to remind everybody that that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: To get the most out of this session I guess it you really needed to kind of watch or attend the field trip beforehand.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I apologize, that it was all pre recorded and and just kind of like a long very own PowerPoint presentation, it would have been nice obviously to visit the section which currently.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Have katie boundary sands are about 40 feet underwater right now due to high discharge on the Tongue big be river.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Of course coven would have kept us from getting out there and also some issues with access.
savrdce@auburn.edu: To the exposure, but hopefully you got something out of it, hopefully, there were enough photographs and that sort of thing.
savrdce@auburn.edu: That you found the trip informative anyway.
savrdce@auburn.edu: But with that i'll just kind of.
savrdce@auburn.edu: turn it over to kind of open it up.
Michael Thonis: I know, on that point, the one you just made about the location.
Michael Thonis: If I think you do mentioned in the video that there's a maybe something under a bridge somewhere, but is that it in terms of in terms of the boundary in that area.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I can speak to that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah go ahead Andy Andy just communicated so.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I live 30 miles away from Moscow.
Rindsberg, Andrew: And I work at uw at the University of West Alabama.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So i've been there i've talked with the landowner i've talked with his previous land after.
Rindsberg, Andrew: As well and i've looked into the property ownership situation.
Rindsberg, Andrew: The only publicly own part of that outcrop that is visible that can be visited is the part immediately below the bridge and within.
Rindsberg, Andrew: An easement around at 10 or 15 feet that's it.
Rindsberg, Andrew: All of the outcrop that that chuck chuck is described is on private land, including.
Rindsberg, Andrew: part that we normally would consider an Alabama to be public land along the river bank.
Rindsberg, Andrew: But it's not long river bank it's a long an artificial lake bank.
Rindsberg, Andrew: And the original property line goes right down to the original river bank which is now deeply submerged So if you look at a property ownership map it actually shows that he owns land that is some permanently submerged below the Tom big bear lake.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Which means that it's vital to get the word out that people shouldn't just traipse around on this man's land, because he is touchy about it, but he does, let people go with permission.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So we, we need to treat this one gently.
Michael Thonis: I wasn't planning to go, but I just was wondering I just don't know enough about I don't spend enough time I haven't spent enough time in Alabama to know.
Michael Thonis: How much how much exposure the Roosevelt crops, how much alcohol exposure there is so I didn't know if this is, you know really special that you can see the boundary because you can't see it anywhere else in Alabama.
Rindsberg, Andrew: You can you can visit the boundary the easiest place to go, is it near a small town.
Rindsberg, Andrew: About 30 miles to the east called Jefferson.
Rindsberg, Andrew: uh huh but you'll have to take a shovel because.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Country continually gets overgrown but you what you recognizes the clayton sand.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Yes, keep sticking out, you can dig above and below that it's even fall, but if you have enough students to dig it out, please do.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Okay, should even go a little further east.
savrdce@auburn.edu: near brags.
savrdce@auburn.edu: there's another exposure of katie boundary beneath actually add a new bridge that's kind of in the middle of nowhere.
savrdce@auburn.edu: there's a clayton Sam body there, but I think that's a completely different orange and the katie boundary sands at moscow's.
savrdce@auburn.edu: landing in the ones in Jefferson.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So that are getting others on private land that Shell creek and, in this very meeting and see there was a skin to.
savrdce@auburn.edu: josh.
Rindsberg, Andrew: are starting with.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Cash broussard yeah.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah.
Rindsberg, Andrew: yeah he's working with George Philips.
Rindsberg, Andrew: They located a new outcropping and near starkville Mississippi.
Michael Thonis: Good.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Also, private land.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah and one of those Sam bodies look like it's chock full of cereals altered.
Rindsberg, Andrew: To preserve remarkable yeah.
Michael Thonis: So that was I had one other question and i'll be quiet, but just how you kind of answered it a little bit, but how representative, if you look at the different look at the cloud formation, for example, how.
Michael Thonis: How much does that change as you go, you know horizontally through the through the formation from you know across I mean I looked at the math it looks like it's very extensive.
Michael Thonis: Is it is your site is it the site in this in this field trip, you know, is it special or is it really quite typical.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I think it's a more difficult site, I think, in the field trip, we talked about the thickness of the quaint information in central Alabama where it's actually differentiated.
savrdce@auburn.edu: into the pine Baron Member and the mcbride limestone Member, and then the pine Baron Member in central Alabama there are, I would say 20 or so morrow limestone couplets very similar to the ones.
savrdce@auburn.edu: In the lower part of the clayton and.
savrdce@auburn.edu: i've always kind of viewed them as sort of, say, you only have maybe four or five meters of the same type of sediment whereas you have 27 meters or Molar.
savrdce@auburn.edu: In the pine Barry Member and i've always kind of thought of those is sort of down lapping Paris sequence.
savrdce@auburn.edu: That maybe down lapping on to some sort of surface of maximum starvation, so I think that the mosque landing section, where the quaintness much thinner I think it's much it's more disturbing than then in central Alabama.
mm hmm.
Michael Thonis: In a one last question similar to all those questions is.
Michael Thonis: Is you mentioned, I think, in the prairie bluff.
Michael Thonis: chalk, you know it's very shallow in fact probably exposed to above above sea level at some points above water level at some points.
Michael Thonis: But I didn't I couldn't pick up how deep it might it might be below the surface of the water.
savrdce@auburn.edu: main at the time of deposition or when it was eroded.
Michael Thonis: What is that no, no, at the time the deposition you right like what what would have been the typical deposition yeah.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I think that's it might have been 10s of meters.
Michael Thonis: tensorflow API under 100 meters.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Under a guest so and it's only because we have that admixed sand.
savrdce@auburn.edu: and presumably the shelf was influenced periodically by storms, where you had discrete sand layers being deposited storm beds, but because it's so strata graphically condense that that thorough buyer probation is totally admixed.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The.
savrdce@auburn.edu: booze basically with all of the the classic detritus that were shared in periodically.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah what I thought you were asking about was erosion at the top of the prayer bluff which is it's interesting because if you look at the Alabama state map.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And angie correct me if i'm wrong, but a little bit further to the east of the Moscow landing area, the prairie bluff is absent.
savrdce@auburn.edu: it's completely eroded, I think the lower.
savrdce@auburn.edu: paleocene is sitting on the ripley if i'm not mistaken.
savrdce@auburn.edu: At least that's the way it's.
mapped.
Rindsberg, Andrew: The haven't seen anywhere where it's missing, all together, but at the type locality of Perry bluff and so here on the Alabama river.
Rindsberg, Andrew: It is almost missing it's very it's.
Rindsberg, Andrew: been nine feet thick.
Michael Thonis: And you think.
Michael Thonis: And you think eroded not it was there, but then eroded.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I think it's been condensed it's.
Rindsberg, Andrew: chock full of shells.
Michael Thonis: And at that point.
Rindsberg, Andrew: it's it's.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So typical week we named the.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Before nation for one of the least typical.
Rindsberg, Andrew: disclosures.
Michael Thonis: Completely true here in Boston we've got a number of famous formations, you know that are hugely visible everywhere except that the tight locality, you know.
Michael Thonis: But that's where someone did the original work right right.
savrdce@auburn.edu: But getting back Mike to one of your earlier comments about exposures and coastal plain.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Overall, I mean, given our climate in the associated vegetation exposures and the coastal plain are not very good so.
savrdce@auburn.edu: We have some local typically short road cut exposures, but a lot of times we rely on on the rivers and then of course we're, we have to rely on discharge and flooding, and what that does to accessibility.
Michael Thonis: it's just that it's a shame in ways that the places that are close to if if you know the meteor the media or is that.
Michael Thonis: Media right media or if the asteroid is the is the culprit here.
Michael Thonis: which I think you have evidence that it has a role it plays a role in this.
Michael Thonis: It may play a significant role in this it's just a shame that the outcrops are hardest to find right.
Michael Thonis: I mean, even the right, even the asteroid itself is buried, but I mean even but all of these all of these sites that could be.
Michael Thonis: places where they were where they were or large title were large tsunamis may have occurred or not particularly great across.
Michael Thonis: And that's kind of true almost everywhere, I think most of the well I don't want to say i'll just I think that places like Cuba is where you see more evidence of mega tsunami.
Michael Thonis: But it doesn't mean it couldn't have happened were you were you are right.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah how crops are isolated, there are a number of places like brazos river in Texas in several places, and I think northern Mexico that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah we're we have Sam bodies that are dear the case, excuse me.
savrdce@auburn.edu: That are invariably interpreted related to the impact.
Michael Thonis: yeah yeah well.
Rindsberg, Andrew: we're in a much better situation for this and Alabama than we are and and most of the rest of the Gulf remley have more outcrops.
Rindsberg, Andrew: denser a number of decent crops and elsewhere and Compare that to say the lower Chesapeake impact crater.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Only nothing ever.
Rindsberg, Andrew: happened well drilling for.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Now.
Michael Thonis: I should they survived I think they first advised, I think, based on tech tights and then do an analysis of.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Oh that's right.
Michael Thonis: Where they might have come from, and is it Oh, and then drilling supported I don't know actually for sure, which came first, but I think I think it was first just looking at the tech tech field.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Just as an aside.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Several years ago chuck's.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Colleague at auburn David king.
Rindsberg, Andrew: He organized a mini conference on the tonka impact crater of Alabama.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Which is not related to the sheep sulu impact.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Its owners, he yeah he it's still involved as cretaceous but it's older and he brought in people from all over the world, who had studied impact craters and since I lived in Alabama I went.
Michael Thonis: and
Rindsberg, Andrew: Out of curiosity, I asked the participants, how many impact craters have you seen him, you know, everybody said, well, other than the weed tonka crater.
Rindsberg, Andrew: And meteor crater out in Arizona i've seen the only the only other one i've seen is the one that I just just studied, so the Chesapeake people had only seen at most three craters.
Rindsberg, Andrew: yeah ever and since I had been to meteor crater we chunk and.
Rindsberg, Andrew: The whales creek structure in Tennessee I actually was right up there that rare.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Most people it's like people studying ivory big build woodpeckers.
Michael Thonis: yeah it's pretty rare looks like a pretty rare and I think that is the manson one in iowa, I think, which is smaller and then there's that one up in Quebec.
Michael Thonis: The medic medic Coogan is it.
Rindsberg, Andrew: My point is that, if you're studying the tsunami features and most people like like chuck who studied tsunami features have just seen the one.
Rindsberg, Andrew: yeah right Am I correct.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Well, I think I think that's been the issue all along is we we people talk about tsunami deposits and I kind of avoid that term I like mega way better for the katie boundaries.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Because we have.
savrdce@auburn.edu: No modern analogs for the the magnitude of.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The event that occurred at the end of the quotations.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And one of the things that bothered me early on, originally when I was looking at katie boundary Sections I focused on muscle creek and central Alabama and I was convinced it was a thin little insides valley film.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah and so then moved out to Moscow landing and I fell into the trap where whatever these sans even though they're very different than the ones that muscle creek I had to try to pigeonhole them into my preconceived notion of what was going on.
savrdce@auburn.edu: on the opposite side of the coin is because we have no modern analogs people good look at some of these katie boundary deposits in make observations and then interpret them.
savrdce@auburn.edu: In terms of they were free to kind of interpret them in terms of what they perceive was going on in terms of some giant mega.
savrdce@auburn.edu: mega wave event for which they had no matter modern analogues or no way of testing, but after spending more and more time that up Muscat landing I just can't see how you could explain.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Those Sam bodies and other work in any other way than then to say that at least the lower parts of them were in place by some very large no wait.
Sharon Browning: question here, someone who's who seen this site and.
Sharon Browning: At the time, in my career was going to agree with whatever the Professor says i've watched your presentation twice, and I remember, noting an iridium layer in my notes and you didn't mention that in the video, and so I was curious about that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Note there was no I don't think anybody's documented any high concentration of iridium.
At.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Moscow landing if you go to muscle creek and there is a somewhat enrich the iridium layer just above the boundary but it's not a real big spike in it it's in a very, very, very cool oxygenated.
Sharon Browning: Thought i'd missed that.
Sharon Browning: But I had that in my original field notes.
yeah.
Michael Thonis: it's a great question I had wonder, the same thing, I know, though, that iridium you know it is a necessary thing that the iridium be distributed smoothly and evenly across the planet right.
Michael Thonis: It could be and I don't know I don't know whether you've ever ever Is anyone ever founded radium close up to the.
Michael Thonis: You know, to the to the suspect meteor asteroid.
Michael Thonis: In fact isn't it sort of generally associated with some some plays of some sort i'm thinking of the brazos situation and I don't know much about it.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah I mean it was originally discovered in a very fine grain pelagic mud rock that's how the whole thing got started and.
savrdce@auburn.edu: But the one in central Alabama is it just not off the charts and it could easily be explained by very slow sedimentation yeah yeah.
Michael Thonis: So you know, this is a little bit crazy but.
Michael Thonis: But I was thinking about your surfing shrimp and.
Michael Thonis: I actually showed the photo to my wife very cute i'm actually right now in Cape cod and we have we have we don't have shrimp, but we have a lot of borrowing things.
Michael Thonis: crustaceans and mollusks and nothing and nothing really borrows quite as fast as you would need it to and your explanation, but I wondered.
Michael Thonis: If if there was any chance that you have evidence they're not evidence, but.
Michael Thonis: You know the suggestion of maybe that that the that the asteroid had baby to did they were two bodies, you know one right after the other one after a few hours after the other, and then i'd be people have talked about whether any of these bodies are.
Michael Thonis: Fully intact when they hit.
Michael Thonis: And I don't know whether that would have bought you know, maybe they were to sit on two mega.
Michael Thonis: mega waves.
savrdce@auburn.edu: well.
Michael Thonis: That would have bought you enough time for those shrimp to borrow deeply enough.
savrdce@auburn.edu: that's a good question, in fact, when we had submitted the paper.
savrdce@auburn.edu: A couple years ago one of the reviewers comments were you know how do you have enough time if if for those shrimp to do you know the buyer debate those.
savrdce@auburn.edu: interviews and of course they're not completely homogenized is.
savrdce@auburn.edu: There discrete burrows super imposed on laminated sand and, if you look into the literature, there are a variety of papers that described the Berlin rates of certain types of kalyan acid trim and it's highly variable but.
savrdce@auburn.edu: some indication that they might borrow or up to 50 centimeters per hour or something like that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And the other thing, too, is that you got a try to put myself in a shrimp in the body of a shrimp that was just catastrophic Lee.
savrdce@auburn.edu: transported by a mega wave and then lived to tell about it, I would imagine that that would have a significant impact on you know sort of helter skelter what the hell's going on i'm gonna burn really quickly to.
savrdce@auburn.edu: be yes.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And so I think there's enough evidence from the literature of modern shrimpton.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The other side of that story, I should point out is that you know people have modeled the progress.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Of the waves and it wasn't one big mega wave we had these waves oscillating back and forth across the proto Gulf of Mexico.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And I think they indicated that the period one modeling paper that the period would be a bait about eight hours and so maybe there were periods of relative qui essence in between waves that these locks on a set that's what they are these pioneers.
savrdce@auburn.edu: would have maybe an hour or a few hours to actually do the work we seem manifest those The lesson.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Well, I don't think I don't I think this is that was the least plausible part of your your field trip but.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Obviously the birds are there.
Rindsberg, Andrew: An alternative hypothesis might be that they there aren't very many visible vertical shafts and that they are actually.
Rindsberg, Andrew: They conquer and they preferred particular layers within the sand, for some reason, and we know that animals, sometimes do that it would all be it would still be peculiar because.
Rindsberg, Andrew: they're like three basic layers and they have different segments illogical styles.
Rindsberg, Andrew: As you've noticed.
Rindsberg, Andrew: What i'd like to know is.
Rindsberg, Andrew: The one at least the ones toward the top are filled with chalk, so I presume that if micro micro paleontologist.
Rindsberg, Andrew: took scrapings from that they find clayton age material i'd like to know about the lower ones, though.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Right so.
Rindsberg, Andrew: that's festival.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah and that's one of the things that I sorta was alluding to in terms of suggestions toward the end of the of the field trip but what's interesting is in both same body one in six.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The same body six only has the one clearly defined layer and then that's I think equivalent to the upper layer at Sam body one.
savrdce@auburn.edu: You have the penetrating across from the base of the clayton you have planar laminated sandstone that doesn't appear to be disrupted at all.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And then you have an interval that's got more of a marley matrix and then you're back into parallel emanated sans that have the borough.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And so it's my impression that the source horizon may actually be coming out of one of those Marty earlier intervals, which might suggest that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: A little bit of a I don't want to say slack water but qui essence, where we had more time to maybe settle out some of the MIC right that got put into suspension.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Excuse me if, in fact, that was related to to the mega waves, but I agonized in both of those same bodies, whether those were discrete buyer debated horizons and I hope we can get out there.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And look at them together and.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I would be nice.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Because I argued with myself, you know, often and had to convince myself that those were discrete internal buyer debater horizons and.
Rindsberg, Andrew: i've been well looking at your your slides I was planning to just delve into my memory of trying to remember what the field relations were, and it would be so easy to point to it and try to figure it out on on the outcrop yeah.
Rindsberg, Andrew: But they.
Rindsberg, Andrew: See.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Have you taken then sections of the clayton sandstone I know it's pretty friable stuff.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Like we have a we have a few things sections through upward through one of the.
savrdce@auburn.edu: sand bodies now I can't remember which number.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And those samples were taken fairly early before we were actually numbering them.
savrdce@auburn.edu: But they do vary texturally and they also vary significantly, I think the ones in the lower part primarily contain a.
savrdce@auburn.edu: particular topic carbonate cements and then some of the other intervals, are more blocky or, in some cases it's a MIC right matrix summit, so the matrix the green size in the matrix do very.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Through through the units one of the things that I think would be interesting, we we didn't do this is take a closer look at sediment technology, for example.
savrdce@auburn.edu: same body one or any of the same bodies, I mean they're clearly deposition will units.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And it would be interesting to see whether you can actually even though they're discreet Sam bodies, whether you could match up.
savrdce@auburn.edu: texturally or fabric wise, because that would indicate that they're responding to the same.
savrdce@auburn.edu: deposition process in these fault bounded depth of centers as opposed to oh you've got some near shore.
savrdce@auburn.edu: sedimentation going on in these.
savrdce@auburn.edu: flooded areas.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And so I think that's something that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: That that could be done.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Look at a little bit more carefully.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Another queue that I have is if.
Rindsberg, Andrew: The bird is at the top of the co plane, or whatever, whatever you call it.
Rindsberg, Andrew: they're doing much the same thing in the chalk, as they are in the sand and if the sound was loose, then why aren't they doing a few morphing the sand and the last night is in the chalk.
savrdce@auburn.edu: that's.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Why, why are they.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Helping they're reinforcing their versus pay them.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Well it's interesting question the.
savrdce@auburn.edu: There they're clearly differences in overall morphology I think the ones where there's no clayton saying they tend to be more vertical.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And so I would consider those things to represent firm grounds I don't see anything in the ones that are placed in the tops of the same bodies.
savrdce@auburn.edu: It looks like they're just you know plain old the last annoyed ease and placed in a granular sand but getting back to your question is.
savrdce@auburn.edu: If those things are being placed as the shore face migrates landward and the substrates they're being placed in aren't necessarily shifting and characterized by rapid erosion or rapid deposition maybe the crustaceans didn't need to tell it ties the other.
savrdce@auburn.edu: potential problem is that most of the fields of those burrows have been washed out.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah due to high water in the river.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Yes, but you can see the chalk and then, if you look yeah for her.
savrdce@auburn.edu: But, but I have one photograph that I took probably 15 years ago from Sam body six the one at the southern end where it actually so, and this would be in one of these lead internal.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Fire debated horizons, there is one that has fluted engines that look for all the world like it was pelted in the pellets as well as the film were washed out.
savrdce@auburn.edu: But it's only one.
Rindsberg, Andrew: But this brings up another point I hadn't occurred to me until this moment.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Okay you've got a mega wave has just brought in Washington sand and and shrimp the doomed pioneers.
Rindsberg, Andrew: That sand is not fun, no, it does the shrimp couldn't this shrimp or as would have collapsed, but this was saying that had been deposited only hours before.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I don't know why would.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Why would they necessarily collapse, I mean we see a crust the shrimp burrows in.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The last and he's in near shore sans.
Rindsberg, Andrew: These would be sensitive been deposited only hours before it would be fixed Tropic it'd be very.
Rindsberg, Andrew: wet.
savrdce@auburn.edu: well.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I don't know how fix a tropical.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Be that's an interesting point, though, so.
savrdce@auburn.edu: You just don't like my megaliths surfing.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Just looked so normal.
Rindsberg, Andrew: there's too much of them.
Michael Thonis: The sand bodies or or maybe they're if they're fought fall down they might be drink me they may be an orientation to the overall were there, or just coincidentally on this site.
Michael Thonis: The six or four on the site that were there drain where they drain or they may just be dipping the actual the actual fault Valley, the valley created by the faulty maybe just draining you know in some direction and drying fairly quickly.
Rindsberg, Andrew: move would also be under the sea.
Michael Thonis: yeah.
savrdce@auburn.edu: resume.
Michael Thonis: that's right yeah that's right see.
savrdce@auburn.edu: One of the things I mean john Smith, who also interprets the wedge shapes and bodies as as related to mega wave deposition one of the things that he didn't consider.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Is that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: If they pray bluff clayton contact is a sequence boundary.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And if there are no one size valley feels and it's a Co plane or transgressive sequence boundary.
savrdce@auburn.edu: sea level had to a fall sometime before deposition of the clayton sand, and so the question is when the mega waves if assuming mega waves, the positive.
savrdce@auburn.edu: All or parts of the same bodies.
savrdce@auburn.edu: What was the sea level and i'm not saying that prairie bluff had to been severely exposed but sea level had to have fallen in the lake rotations.
Michael Thonis: I was thinking sub Ariel exposed between the between the mega waves, because you know when there's a mega wave it the way it pulls all the water back away from away from the shoreline puts the shoreline way out.
Michael Thonis: It just that's watching videos you know things like that Japan tsunami or the tsunami in the Indian Ocean, where it's just a huge amount of water just disappears goes out 30 miles and then come back with a vengeance.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I don't know we know how.
hard.
Rindsberg, Andrew: i'm sorry I don't think anyone knows truly how high the wave was.
Michael Thonis: No right right i'm just thinking about several possibility and.
Michael Thonis: These these and these shrimp are scrambling to get down to you know below the water table locally.
Michael Thonis: And you've got eight hours to do it, and I know is that I don't know enough about this topic, but does that who knows right.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Not a geophysicist.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Things.
savrdce@auburn.edu: do with it, when the argument became Okay, are these.
savrdce@auburn.edu: mega wave deposits or they thin little in size valley feels I mean insides me how he feels let's say in the western interior, where you had greater substance and more accommodation space they're up to 10s if not hundreds of meters.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The sand bodies are probably no more than two meters stick, but if you.
savrdce@auburn.edu: How do you get an inside Valley, to you, you have sea level fall subfertile exposure and erosion.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And then during the initial transgression.
savrdce@auburn.edu: As base levels rise you fill in those depressions and then the short face comes through well now let's take a mega wave.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The trough of the mega wave hits first so you have withdrawal of the sea.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And then, as the.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The first mega wave comes running through.
savrdce@auburn.edu: You could.
savrdce@auburn.edu: conceivably feel these depressions in this case, they were produced by faulting if we said.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Moscow landing and then.
savrdce@auburn.edu: That erosion will surface at the top could potentially have something to do with the the mega which so to me it's like this the mega wave model could almost.
savrdce@auburn.edu: be a sped up version of a sea levels.
yeah.
Rindsberg, Andrew: yeah.
Rindsberg, Andrew: You could have.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Okay you've got the Sheikh shalhoub impact that's going to generate the granddaddy of all earthquakes, so the faults are formed before the tsunamis hit several hours later.
Michael Thonis: mm hmm yeah they're happening almost simultaneously with that well not simultaneously but pretty quickly after the event, I should I don't know that due to mega waves travel faster than seismic waves I think they travel more slowly, I think.
Michael Thonis: Ours our slogan.
Rindsberg, Andrew: She actually would have been what 900 miles south of here I think about 1000 miles.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I wouldn't hazard a guess have to look at a map.
Michael Thonis: I think that sounds right but you're in your in your geophysicist so you.
Rindsberg, Andrew: said what you said earlier.
Michael Thonis: So how fast would.
Michael Thonis: plus or minus a few hundred miles, what would you know kilometers what would how fast does it take for the seismic the first seismic waves to arrive, not long right.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Hours hours.
Scott Brande: yeah well the the the propagation of.
Scott Brande: Body waves and the crust is somewhere around call it, five, six kilometres per second and.
Scott Brande: The segment of the tsunami waves.
Scott Brande: are only about four to 450 miles an hour so as as Andy said it's it's a huge difference.
Scott Brande: In the transmission time between the head of the seismic wave and the head of the the ocean wave.
Michael Thonis: So the series of events could be the impact, then the huge mega earthquake, you know which breaks up at least the surface, and these are probably semi liquefied right materials right and.
Michael Thonis: And then.
Michael Thonis: And then the next event happens is that the way the water pulls out like a like a regression just pulls way out.
Michael Thonis: And then, and then hours later comes back with a vengeance, and that probably repeats a few times meanwhile the shrimp you know they're like have no idea what's going on right, but all they know is that every time you get a chance, he just borrow down.
Rindsberg, Andrew: well.
Rindsberg, Andrew: there's your walk and get away.
savrdce@auburn.edu: My theory.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I like Superman additional evidence for you some things that you may not have been able to see because I had somewhat different experiences at the side.
Rindsberg, Andrew: But that's.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Instead of poking at your weak point let's i'm going to i'm going to strengthen your already strong point okay.
Rindsberg, Andrew: bear with me i've got more than one point here one of them, the faults, I have more than once, gone down on a boat trip from demonic lists to Moscow landing.
Rindsberg, Andrew: On the Tom baby river at the marvelous the faults are few and displacement is like.
Rindsberg, Andrew: As you go farther South the displacement the faults become more numerous and the displacement displacement gets greater until you get to Moscow landing and virtually every KPMG site now Alabama I don't know about brags but as far as I know, all of the others are faulted.
Rindsberg, Andrew: including some that are now permanently underwater destroyed by eugene Allen Smith in the in the 1800s I can't bluff.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So this these folks are not local.
Rindsberg, Andrew: This you can pretty much assume that the whole coastal plain of Alabama got faulted and I think simultaneously.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Okay, so that's one strengthening piece of evidence, another is the caitlyn the cobbles of chalk.
Rindsberg, Andrew: They are the wrong shape to be formed in local creeks and rivers i've been on many creeks and rivers and Alabama and if that child was anything like the chocolate today, maybe a little less less liquefied it should be shaped in slabs.
Rindsberg, Andrew: They tend to get plucked up in the in the creeks and then moved if they're broken down much further they're not slabs anymore or or blocks or rectangular blocks that are often joint bound rounded.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Rather than these very rounded looking cobbles that you see at Moscow landing, I simply don't believe that there's a river process that could produce that shape of chalk.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So we've got something else, those that truck rolled.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Okay, what we should be looking for is armory of these giant clay balls.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Another feature that some of this chalk day breathe some of it quite course is actually injected down into these faults that Moscow landing.
Rindsberg, Andrew: That means that those faults moved exactly once.
Rindsberg, Andrew: and did not otherwise there's chalk cobbles would today be smeared.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So yes, some of the faults did continue to move in the paleocene I think that's clear, but some of them moved once.
Rindsberg, Andrew: During a disaster.
Scott Brande: And a with regard to those boulders if you will.
Scott Brande: Is there any petrol graphic analysis of the.
Scott Brande: interior of those.
Scott Brande: is just a partners or cobbles.
Scott Brande: versus verte couples versus.
Scott Brande: The matrix which would be within a couple of centimeters outside I mean i'm i'm trying to picture.
Scott Brande: The degree to which.
Scott Brande: The chalk held together.
Scott Brande: In a.
Scott Brande: In a mechanical way.
Scott Brande: As different from the surrounding matrix.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I certainly haven't done any such studies Oh, there was one other thing to notice that was john smith's.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Observation he he found and i'm.
Rindsberg, Andrew: jack has confirmed that there were three main pebble to cut cobbled two double beds there, they are finding upwards, each one it's as if there was a way there's another wave and he had a third wave, how many more ways we don't know.
Rindsberg, Andrew: But as far as cryptography goes.
Rindsberg, Andrew: it's an open field.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And it's interesting too, because in some of those wedge shaped bodies it's clear that there was a fault scarf.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And those class were more or less being check that probably coming over the top, but those the work and glamour attic intervals, then, can shout generally to the north, depending what Sam body are looking looking at so they're probably all sorts of other things that could be.
savrdce@auburn.edu: done to try to fill in.
savrdce@auburn.edu: In.
Rindsberg, Andrew: This important.
Rindsberg, Andrew: there's there's not another outcrop it's so expensive that shows all these features.
Sharon Browning: For saving, I want to get out to Moscow landing again anytime this year.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Maybe.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I haven't been out there now and and probably over a year.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Colvin.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And the property situation kind of hit I was under the impression that the.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And Andy clarified this at the beginning of our session but I had the misunderstanding that property lines or high water.
savrdce@auburn.edu: mark and also there is a the gas pipeline that goes through the River there's a an access for utility and thinking that that was also public right away, and as Andy described before.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I was wrong, it had been trespass.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And so I think if we make the right connections Andy has already started and.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I may try to introduce myself and.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Give them a glossy.
savrdce@auburn.edu: balloon up map strip napa there shoreline maybe that would use a dad of the call the COPs and say how did you do this with that trespassing them I.
Michael Thonis: don't have the sweet occupies of that one.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Well, I when I talked to him, like, I had a field trip and co and he said, what are you doing here.
Rindsberg, Andrew: There I was at the bridge and we had quite a discussion I he left he, let us go.
Rindsberg, Andrew: But I think mostly it was his honor that was being that he was thinking about he does, I don't think he really cares about all these field trips, as long as people ask for permission ahead time.
Michael Thonis: Was, you know as long as you know, find a whole a whole tire and osiris fossil you know in there because that's that's out West right wyoming in.
Rindsberg, Andrew: The code and that would be the kiss of death.
Michael Thonis: yeah nobody.
Michael Thonis: will know rancher will it just doesn't happen anymore, they will not give you access on the properties.
Sharon Browning: But I wonder to about a liability issue because, if I remember that.
Sharon Browning: Ben riverbank can be pretty slippery.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Sometimes, yes yeah he was.
Rindsberg, Andrew: He was concerned about.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I wrote a handwritten liability waiver and.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Had everyone sign it on the spot.
Yes, that better.
Michael Thonis: picture, do you have a do you have a.
Michael Thonis: Full a composite of photographs of the I can't remember I don't think I saw that in the video of your strip map, but you have.
Michael Thonis: Like you know what I mean a panorama.
savrdce@auburn.edu: know.
savrdce@auburn.edu: When I first started working out their digital cameras or.
Michael Thonis: yeah yeah.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And in order to try to sketch what we were seeing we dragged a canoe down there and I took an old polaroid camera.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And as we floated down the river right, and so, and then what we did was put overlays on that sketched it so that the geometry is a little distorted but.
savrdce@auburn.edu: We have some cross sectional view sketches that we've done but.
savrdce@auburn.edu: It would have been neat to do a you know, to get a drone out there.
Michael Thonis: Well, I was just thinking about my museum of science, you know how that would make a great Ural.
Michael Thonis: In health people understand get us, you know it, you know, point out that we don't know sure what happened, but one possibility is.
Michael Thonis: As supported, partly by this panorama this mural is the following story which I just think it's kind of you know you always wanting to museum to be as scintillating as possible yeah.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Well, given the scale and the length of minutes, one point Gomez two kilometers long and and the outcrops Andy what maximum five meters in any one place if you.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Had a whole panorama you wouldn't be able to see.
Michael Thonis: No, but you know what these digital which you can do with these digital photos, as you can change the scales, you know, however, often the trial set.
savrdce@auburn.edu: stretch it out.
Michael Thonis: Well, you know the Cross section, you might have you know five X.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah.
Michael Thonis: On the vertical you can do that, you can actually do that with a with you know by digitizing it.
Michael Thonis: And i've seen actually were there's a name for it, but the you can take separate photos and then using software stitch them together like you're just one.
Michael Thonis: Like one large panoramic photo it's got huge detail, you know the pixels are terrific.
Sharon Browning: Are you talking about like a giga pan.
Michael Thonis: yeah good Japan that's it, thank you, the giga pan yeah that that technology.
Van Burbach: i'm gonna have to.
Michael Thonis: deal.
With thanks.
Michael Thonis: So that would you know you can really grateful i'm just i'm just thinking of maybe maybe i'll make contact you at some point.
Michael Thonis: and go on a field trip with you and we'll get all the right permissions.
Rindsberg, Andrew: That would be so wonder.
Rindsberg, Andrew: It should be done on a.
Rindsberg, Andrew: On a day when the river is flat so.
Michael Thonis: Low.
Rindsberg, Andrew: The drones you're right with drones you wouldn't matter with it.
Rindsberg, Andrew: wow.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Well, I think it'd be hard to settle the issue of the mega wave surfing shrimp using a drone I think.
savrdce@auburn.edu: We need to get our nose right on.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The good.
Scott Brande: hey chuck i'm going to have to go shortly, but I just wanted to bring back, maybe a memory that I have held strongly since 1996 and specifically in May and you might You might remember whoops, how can I do this.
Sharon Browning: Virtual background.
Scott Brande: Yes, buddy oh there it is.
Michael Thonis: Okay dad dinosaurs.
Scott Brande: dead dead dead dinosaurs right, and this is when yeah i'll see if I can get this this is when Walter Alvarez came to Alabama for his one.
Scott Brande: Guided field trip with you, and what I did is since a friend of mine was writing for the burnham news Jeff handsome.
Scott Brande: came along on the trip and I brought to Birmingham City school teachers and so we had a wonderful time with you as you were leading one of your your local field trips down there may may of 1996.
Scott Brande: And and Alvarez apparently enjoyed it greatly at that time.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Are you are you talking to Andy.
Scott Brande: No i'm talking.
Scott Brande: i'm talking to you chuck.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Oh well, i'll take credit for, but I think I would Alvarez, on a future down there so.
Scott Brande: yeah well.
Scott Brande: well.
Sharon Browning: shoemaker.
Scott Brande: It definitely.
Rindsberg, Andrew: wasn't me.
Michael Thonis: well.
savrdce@auburn.edu: crowded Charlie Charlie Smith navy.
Scott Brande: Was Charlie the one who argued against.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Yes.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Yes, and he's he's a nano expert.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I don't know what he's doing now, but he says that eventually he wants his ashes, to be spread at Moscow.
Scott Brande: Oh good Lord.
Scott Brande: well.
Scott Brande: In any case, i've got the head off, but thanks for the incredible graphics and the photographs as well chuck so I really appreciate it.
Michael Thonis: Thanks, thank you, thank you chuck i'm gonna go to thank you.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Mike Thank you.
Rindsberg, Andrew: well.
Sharon Browning: But preserving, it is an issue because I remember seeing the ups site just off of air base boulevard and and that's gone now because it took that CAP rock for the zoo and that meat or scale cross stratification that was preserved there yeah I think it was the utah formation.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah the topic be saying.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Suddenly, so the River outcrops are.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Self renewing in a way, I mean it's a subtracted process, the fact is, you can go there many times and see something different, every time you go.
Oh, you.
savrdce@auburn.edu: know the.
savrdce@auburn.edu: you're talking about preservation, I thought, what this may be a harebrained idea and Andy I think you were highly involved in the what is the Union Chapel mind is that the right.
Rindsberg, Andrew: One time yes.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah in terms of getting that preserved.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Is that state property now right.
Rindsberg, Andrew: It is.
savrdce@auburn.edu: i'm just wondering whether we could figure out a way of preserving a strip of the Moscow landing section.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Through a similar type of effort.
Rindsberg, Andrew: It would be very different the Union Chapel mine was.
Rindsberg, Andrew: A whole line of being shot.
Rindsberg, Andrew: down, so the.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Congress had to had to interfere, because it was because there was a federal law sayings inactive minds, have to be covered over again.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So they had to make an exception, we got support from at her fault, one of our State Representatives.
Rindsberg, Andrew: This and it was private property, and then I.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I don't know how much money the other owners were given that they got something from the state I don't know how we've managed to do this in this.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Is yeah I thought there was some sort of fundraising effort that actually.
Rindsberg, Andrew: got better was.
savrdce@auburn.edu: It to some degree, this could potentially be simpler, because you don't have the coal mining regulation.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And it's kind of like you know just up to the edge of the woods, what are they going to do at that those nicely exposed products.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And then they wouldn't have to worry about liability and it could be, it could be administered similar to the way the Herald station, or something like that is where it's through University of Alabama or something like that so.
savrdce@auburn.edu: So there is some control on accessed but.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And there be some sort of central clearing house or something that that let people in or gotten lucky or whatever, but.
Rindsberg, Andrew: You who operates as a sumter county nature trust on.
Rindsberg, Andrew: And through that they operate.
Rindsberg, Andrew: A site on the River on an old bluff part it actually includes the type locality of the bluff part our own, although that was not their intention it's an archaeological site and it includes the laughs along the river, I could look into that and see how that was done.
Rindsberg, Andrew: And that would be one avenue you.
Rindsberg, Andrew: could also see that we could.
Rindsberg, Andrew: go through the nature conservancy.
Rindsberg, Andrew: which has a huge amount of experience in talking with landowners and soothing their ruffled feathers and.
Rindsberg, Andrew: And sometimes leaving land in their hands, but within a kind of an easement.
Rindsberg, Andrew: That.
Rindsberg, Andrew: restrict certain kind of usage they do this with.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Oh endangered plants, for instance.
Rindsberg, Andrew: so that you know they might have an easement on a field and say you can hunt there all you like just just don't.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Just don't plow it and use it for crops, you know.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I guess if I was the property owner, I think that my biggest issue is one that Sharon mentioned was is the liability.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And so you know you you filled out those had students sign it, but you know i've been told by lawyers that you know.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Laughter have some that may not be worth the paper they're written on.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Why do we have them.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Question just to make us feel better.
savrdce@auburn.edu: My understanding is.
Sharon Browning: due diligence.
savrdce@auburn.edu: My understanding is and I got a contact Nick to our state geologist who was the one that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Supposedly it's been communicating with the property owner, in the meantime early on, when I found out about the issue of access.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I had a draft our people here are legal folks put together a draft and that might be something that I need to show the property owner to see whether that would suffice, but I know they've been communicating with the lawyers themselves about the liability issue and so.
savrdce@auburn.edu: they're they're not just.
savrdce@auburn.edu: now know off the cuff well we're concerned somebody might get hurt they're communicating bleak with legal counsel about it.
Sharon Browning: Well, one other completely different topic question here, and then I have to go, do you see that I could see this easily being used for for undergraduates have you have you thought about I think I think this field trip is supposed to be made available on GSA website.
Sharon Browning: Is that correct.
savrdce@auburn.edu: audrey I don't know whether she's still listening.
savrdce@auburn.edu: We were, I was asking about that, before.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Apparently, this will remain in what archive for a year, so that anybody.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Who registered already can go back and access, it is that correct or somebody could register for the meeting.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Post meeting and access whatever recordings obsessions and field trips is that accurate.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: yep so so like anything on the meeting that we've recorded is going to be available for up to a year and then.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: you're since it was a pre recorded field trip we're actually going to archive that on the GSA website behind a member of a member wall.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: for however long i'm not quite sure, since this is a new process for GSA we're still trying to figure out kind of that process so.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: I think there's for field trips from the southeast meeting that agreed to have it archives we're still trying to figure out exactly what that looks like and what does that mean.
savrdce@auburn.edu: You know, one of the things early on, when I was trying to design a trip, I was trying to break it into segments where you would show part of it, and then say okay students.
savrdce@auburn.edu: What did you just hear draw cross section and using strategy graphic principal sequence of events, try to figure out what's going on.
savrdce@auburn.edu: But I think you still could introduce things the basic things like strata graphic principles and that sort of thing using polar parts of the trip, so if it's archived as long as somebody's a member, even though they weren't registered for the meeting, they would be able to access.
savrdce@auburn.edu: At least for.
Sharon Browning: myself thinking and in a way, I never imagined we've developed all this online content for our students and.
Sharon Browning: And some of it is is really good and I don't see getting rid of it, especially for field experiences.
Sharon Browning: Okay, I have.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: Yet and there's even then talk just you know kind of going forward with field trips, should we be sending professional photographers or videographers out there and really capturing everything that's a lot more money, but that is kind of the talk of like.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: Is this.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: Where are we going like what we you know covert hit we're dealing with it, how can we kind of continue to maybe.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: make things better.
Sharon Browning: Thank you very much.
savrdce@auburn.edu: No.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Thank you, sharing, that was a great question.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Well, you know discovering Alabama does have does does send out professionals into the field to do just very similarly thanks, but they're not doing it it's such a technical level, as you are checking.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So I think would be that would be wonderful if you could.
Rindsberg, Andrew: If you could get in touch with them with discovering Alabama Doug Phillips.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah I can do with Doug Phillips, and took the sands of time, the mighty Tom big me river here flows southward across the coastal plain.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Until it flowed backward and the great tsunami yeah.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Maybe that's the voice, I should have done the field trip.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: To say where's the British British accent.
Rindsberg, Andrew: What will know that you're doing.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Real detailed work chuck when you tell us what season of the year, it happened in.
Rindsberg, Andrew: i'll bet you can do it with if you look careful attention to the oyster growth lines.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Actually, until I said it, I hadn't realized, it is actually possible.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Well, that would make a great article in nature.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Yes, yes, you draft it up send it to me and i'll add my part.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Right any any other questions comments I think we've we've gone over and I don't know what time is the closing remarks that bill haynes's.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: I have to arrive at 425 mountain time, I think it starts at 545 central time okay.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Any other questions comments so Terry john.
savrdce@auburn.edu: So.
John Fronimos: chuck I didn't have a lot of insights not being a.
John Fronimos: You know somebody who does a lot with trace fossils but I did have.
John Fronimos: One question I imagine you probably would have mentioned it if you'd seen something like this, when you talk about the you know the surfing shrimps and that sort of thing.
John Fronimos: I immediately pictured you know here one of those shrimps that gets you know mixed up in the settlement and buried, would you see any signs of you know escaped traces or anything like that those.
John Fronimos: persist in this type of stuff.
savrdce@auburn.edu: that's a real good question um My guess is that the shrimp probably we're.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Assuming that that's how they were in placed okay.
savrdce@auburn.edu: They were probably more part of a suspended load than, although that Sam was probably in suspension to i'm just guessing that the sand might have come down before they the floating bodies of shrimp but.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I don't know that's a interesting interesting point.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Most of the time when you see escape structures they're usually produced by something that was already on the sea floor or when you had rapid deposition.
savrdce@auburn.edu: But something like this probably would have had a lot of erosion prior to deposition and would have re suspended, you know just looking at regular storm deposits in the trace fossils.
savrdce@auburn.edu: You would think you would find a lot more escape structures and then but I don't hardly ever seen him and I think it's because the base of the V San are typically sharp and original and either the current or the wave energy has reached suspended.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The mud, and probably organisms.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And then eventually you get the sand and then you have things fall out, you know the finer grain tail of the event, so I don't see a lot of I don't see any escape structures, although.
savrdce@auburn.edu: it's kind of hard to see in these buyers for beta intervals, specifically in the quake sans good vertical.
savrdce@auburn.edu: profile, so there are a few places where you can.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I did look at the vertical profiles and I don't remember seeing any escape structures.
Rindsberg, Andrew: or anything except for the last invitees.
Right.
savrdce@auburn.edu: What do you think about that audrey you buy in the mega wave surfing shrimp where's he going with Andy.
Rindsberg, Andrew: i'm just being skeptical i'm not saying.
savrdce@auburn.edu: i'm just trying to spot.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: These surfing transom quite interesting.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Well, I didn't mention that we found the surfboards about that big it's.
savrdce@auburn.edu: evolved been lignin ties, but.
savrdce@auburn.edu: In board with to read oh.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: Yes, i'm making me hungry.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: I.
Rindsberg, Andrew: guess i'm far from time to throw in the towel chuck Bravo, this was an excellent field trip video and the next Q amp a.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And I think you helped make it that way, because you've been there and had a lot to add, I appreciate it, but let's get out there sometime.
Rindsberg, Andrew: vantage this summer i've been vaccinated.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I second one I got two weeks i'll get started.
savrdce@auburn.edu: In the water should be down.
Rindsberg, Andrew: yeah summer.
Rindsberg, Andrew: home resting there in the summer, but.
Rindsberg, Andrew: But to see the only good time to go.
Rindsberg, Andrew: to slip on.
Rindsberg, Andrew: That truck really is slick.
yeah.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: So thank you.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: audrey yeah.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: Thank you fun working with you on this stuff.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah thanks all of you guys at GSA it's.
savrdce@auburn.edu: It seemed painless well thanks.
John Fronimos: truck I wanted to say thank you being being new to the area, you know coming here this past year and still getting a feel for you know the.
John Fronimos: locals photography and geology and things I was a great primer on a lot of them both the first photography and the the general the specific things that make this outcrop so interesting.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Good Where are you located.
John Fronimos: So i'm here at auburn now i'm a lecture on the department, but I just got hired this past fall mean down from vassar and so i'm crash coursing myself and.
John Fronimos: You know I always like to get a feel for this retainer fee as fast as I can but it's sort of yeah.
savrdce@auburn.edu: very long on retired in June, when I did run Louis.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And he's been really hiding.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Know darn you you move.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Across country and during the pandemic and set up a new office and all everything.
John Fronimos: That was interesting it was interesting.
John Fronimos: It was probably about.
John Fronimos: A little earlier than this last year that I was interviewing I was supposed to come down to auburn and then suddenly they said hey we're not traveling anymore rob you know reasons that we're quickly becoming obvious a.
John Fronimos: little bit different from other other moves i've done.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Well you're better off than the you who the biologists who almost became a member of our faculty our our hiring process just collapsed.
John Fronimos: Right after I you know got this position, the.
John Fronimos: You know, seeing that the job listing sort of dry up and things.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Well we're glad you're here john.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Welcome to Alabama.
John Fronimos: Thanks i'm glad to be here glad to circuit and know the area.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Okay.
John Fronimos: So you actually get.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Along with when chuck.
Rindsberg, Andrew: comes together let's go come along.
John Fronimos: i'm glad to come along on any any outing I can get.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Well, I hope everybody has a good Easter weekend yeah I gotta go home and eat fish.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Good fish.
Rindsberg, Andrew: good night everyone.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Thanks, for attending. savrdce@auburn.edu: Thanks, for attending. WEBVTT
savrdce@auburn.edu: Little one go.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: yeah she she see if she gets like tired of me, being in here and then she'll come in and be like she wants to really be on the video screen.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: She really wants to.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Be front and Center she just wants to learn something about quotations Paleo.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: There was um for the Northeast section, there was um.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: I think it's in Connecticut dinosaur national.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: Not there's like a national dinosaur museum.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: And they did this really cool field trip, and it was on a set it was on the weekend, so I made my kids sit with me we watched it and it was really fun so yeah.
John Fronimos: Does that dinosaurs state park with the footprints.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: that's what it was yes.
John Fronimos: And that's in Connecticut right and take classes up there yeah.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: yeah yeah they've been closed and so.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: A lot of things were a little different and they're kind of redoing a lot of different things, because they can right now with people not being there but they did a great job and they'd live stream did and have videos and they were like down crawling around and so it's really cool.
Michael Thonis: yeah there's there's one of those in Connecticut and one of those Massachusetts both of them are in the well the hartford and the deerfield basins, those are the.
Michael Thonis: Those are the the rift basins.
Michael Thonis: mesozoic.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Are they triassic or Jurassic.
Michael Thonis: triassic I think 204 well I think yeah.
John Fronimos: Thanks some of the track ways, or just up into the Jurassic.
Michael Thonis: yeah I might be.
Michael Thonis: that's why I hesitated but what's interesting is that there have been up there and he's been virtually no.
Michael Thonis: almost no fossil bones found dinosaur bones found it's almost the entire there have been fossil fish found, but there are virtually it's almost entirely footprints.
Michael Thonis: And there and they're in Massachusetts Massachusetts they're everywhere, you can go to the park, but you don't really need to.
Michael Thonis: Because you can just walk out in the woods wherever you find it out crap there's footprints all over it.
Michael Thonis: it's really astonishing and yet very few skeletal remains.
Michael Thonis: And there's all kinds of theories about why you know why, why not.
Michael Thonis: The museum is i'm with them i'm a trustee with museum of science in Boston and we.
Michael Thonis: We, along with the state as a contest to two different species of dinosaur fossils that have been farewell footprints then a couple of pounds.
Michael Thonis: Fossil bones, and we just just a month ago there was a contest and it was one of the most popular museum events ever it was to get people to name to choose which of the two.
Michael Thonis: Which are the two dinosaurs would be the state dinosaur.
Michael Thonis: And they were both cool they're both cool dinosaurs are small, but.
Michael Thonis: You know.
Very.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Well, we have only 12 hey Scott there you're you're on the moon.
savrdce@auburn.edu: up here.
savrdce@auburn.edu: you're muted.
Michael Thonis: Well, you can't hear anything on the moon.
Saying.
Scott Brande: hey look i'm a bit older than you so I figured 230,000 miles is efficient social distance in order.
savrdce@auburn.edu: All right, well, it looks like we only have 12 out of the 53 attendees and I know at least a few of them told me they had.
savrdce@auburn.edu: convene other sessions and that sort of thing, so I guess, we can get started, what I wanted what I wanted to do, though, before we actually to the Q amp a for the field trip is to acknowledge our sponsors.
savrdce@auburn.edu: know a number of us were several hats for this meeting, and as as the sponsorship chair, I wanted to personally thank.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The various sponsors for the meeting, and there are a number of corporate sponsors focused material southern company since Tara and Bob fossa comes with Fo sick mineral resources, incorporated and then of course we had excuse me, local support from our own department.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Not only all the work that all the Faculty and students are doing, but some financial support for the meeting.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Also, our college of science and mathematics here at auburn thank Dean Giordano, for his support and then we have a number of other.
savrdce@auburn.edu: alumni and friends that are part of our auburn university geosciences advisory board that should be acknowledged for their their support as well, I also want to thank everybody.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Who.
savrdce@auburn.edu: put together sessions and led sessions, but also everybody who's participated in the in the meetings for those who attended.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The meeting in the folks at GSA because I think they've they're handling this covert crisis.
savrdce@auburn.edu: In a an incredible way and appreciate every everything they've done to help us get this rolling anyway i'll stop sharing the screen for now.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And we can go ahead and and get started with our Q amp a hopefully everybody listening in received my email, I think I sent it on Wednesday evening, just to remind everybody that that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: To get the most out of this session I guess it you really needed to kind of watch or attend the field trip beforehand.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I apologize, that it was all pre recorded and and just kind of like a long very own PowerPoint presentation, it would have been nice obviously to visit the section which currently.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Have katie boundary sands are about 40 feet underwater right now due to high discharge on the Tongue big be river.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Of course coven would have kept us from getting out there and also some issues with access.
savrdce@auburn.edu: To the exposure, but hopefully you got something out of it, hopefully, there were enough photographs and that sort of thing.
savrdce@auburn.edu: That you found the trip informative anyway.
savrdce@auburn.edu: But with that i'll just kind of.
savrdce@auburn.edu: turn it over to kind of open it up.
Michael Thonis: I know, on that point, the one you just made about the location.
Michael Thonis: If I think you do mentioned in the video that there's a maybe something under a bridge somewhere, but is that it in terms of in terms of the boundary in that area.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I can speak to that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah go ahead Andy Andy just communicated so.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I live 30 miles away from Moscow.
Rindsberg, Andrew: And I work at uw at the University of West Alabama.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So i've been there i've talked with the landowner i've talked with his previous land after.
Rindsberg, Andrew: As well and i've looked into the property ownership situation.
Rindsberg, Andrew: The only publicly own part of that outcrop that is visible that can be visited is the part immediately below the bridge and within.
Rindsberg, Andrew: An easement around at 10 or 15 feet that's it.
Rindsberg, Andrew: All of the outcrop that that chuck chuck is described is on private land, including.
Rindsberg, Andrew: part that we normally would consider an Alabama to be public land along the river bank.
Rindsberg, Andrew: But it's not long river bank it's a long an artificial lake bank.
Rindsberg, Andrew: And the original property line goes right down to the original river bank which is now deeply submerged So if you look at a property ownership map it actually shows that he owns land that is some permanently submerged below the Tom big bear lake.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Which means that it's vital to get the word out that people shouldn't just traipse around on this man's land, because he is touchy about it, but he does, let people go with permission.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So we, we need to treat this one gently.
Michael Thonis: I wasn't planning to go, but I just was wondering I just don't know enough about I don't spend enough time I haven't spent enough time in Alabama to know.
Michael Thonis: How much how much exposure the Roosevelt crops, how much alcohol exposure there is so I didn't know if this is, you know really special that you can see the boundary because you can't see it anywhere else in Alabama.
Rindsberg, Andrew: You can you can visit the boundary the easiest place to go, is it near a small town.
Rindsberg, Andrew: About 30 miles to the east called Jefferson.
Rindsberg, Andrew: uh huh but you'll have to take a shovel because.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Country continually gets overgrown but you what you recognizes the clayton sand.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Yes, keep sticking out, you can dig above and below that it's even fall, but if you have enough students to dig it out, please do.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Okay, should even go a little further east.
savrdce@auburn.edu: near brags.
savrdce@auburn.edu: there's another exposure of katie boundary beneath actually add a new bridge that's kind of in the middle of nowhere.
savrdce@auburn.edu: there's a clayton Sam body there, but I think that's a completely different orange and the katie boundary sands at moscow's.
savrdce@auburn.edu: landing in the ones in Jefferson.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So that are getting others on private land that Shell creek and, in this very meeting and see there was a skin to.
savrdce@auburn.edu: josh.
Rindsberg, Andrew: are starting with.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Cash broussard yeah.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah.
Rindsberg, Andrew: yeah he's working with George Philips.
Rindsberg, Andrew: They located a new outcropping and near starkville Mississippi.
Michael Thonis: Good.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Also, private land.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah and one of those Sam bodies look like it's chock full of cereals altered.
Rindsberg, Andrew: To preserve remarkable yeah.
Michael Thonis: So that was I had one other question and i'll be quiet, but just how you kind of answered it a little bit, but how representative, if you look at the different look at the cloud formation, for example, how.
Michael Thonis: How much does that change as you go, you know horizontally through the through the formation from you know across I mean I looked at the math it looks like it's very extensive.
Michael Thonis: Is it is your site is it the site in this in this field trip, you know, is it special or is it really quite typical.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I think it's a more difficult site, I think, in the field trip, we talked about the thickness of the quaint information in central Alabama where it's actually differentiated.
savrdce@auburn.edu: into the pine Baron Member and the mcbride limestone Member, and then the pine Baron Member in central Alabama there are, I would say 20 or so morrow limestone couplets very similar to the ones.
savrdce@auburn.edu: In the lower part of the clayton and.
savrdce@auburn.edu: i've always kind of viewed them as sort of, say, you only have maybe four or five meters of the same type of sediment whereas you have 27 meters or Molar.
savrdce@auburn.edu: In the pine Barry Member and i've always kind of thought of those is sort of down lapping Paris sequence.
savrdce@auburn.edu: That maybe down lapping on to some sort of surface of maximum starvation, so I think that the mosque landing section, where the quaintness much thinner I think it's much it's more disturbing than then in central Alabama.
mm hmm.
Michael Thonis: In a one last question similar to all those questions is.
Michael Thonis: Is you mentioned, I think, in the prairie bluff.
Michael Thonis: chalk, you know it's very shallow in fact probably exposed to above above sea level at some points above water level at some points.
Michael Thonis: But I didn't I couldn't pick up how deep it might it might be below the surface of the water.
savrdce@auburn.edu: main at the time of deposition or when it was eroded.
Michael Thonis: What is that no, no, at the time the deposition you right like what what would have been the typical deposition yeah.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I think that's it might have been 10s of meters.
Michael Thonis: tensorflow API under 100 meters.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Under a guest so and it's only because we have that admixed sand.
savrdce@auburn.edu: and presumably the shelf was influenced periodically by storms, where you had discrete sand layers being deposited storm beds, but because it's so strata graphically condense that that thorough buyer probation is totally admixed.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The.
savrdce@auburn.edu: booze basically with all of the the classic detritus that were shared in periodically.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah what I thought you were asking about was erosion at the top of the prayer bluff which is it's interesting because if you look at the Alabama state map.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And angie correct me if i'm wrong, but a little bit further to the east of the Moscow landing area, the prairie bluff is absent.
savrdce@auburn.edu: it's completely eroded, I think the lower.
savrdce@auburn.edu: paleocene is sitting on the ripley if i'm not mistaken.
savrdce@auburn.edu: At least that's the way it's.
mapped.
Rindsberg, Andrew: The haven't seen anywhere where it's missing, all together, but at the type locality of Perry bluff and so here on the Alabama river.
Rindsberg, Andrew: It is almost missing it's very it's.
Rindsberg, Andrew: been nine feet thick.
Michael Thonis: And you think.
Michael Thonis: And you think eroded not it was there, but then eroded.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I think it's been condensed it's.
Rindsberg, Andrew: chock full of shells.
Michael Thonis: And at that point.
Rindsberg, Andrew: it's it's.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So typical week we named the.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Before nation for one of the least typical.
Rindsberg, Andrew: disclosures.
Michael Thonis: Completely true here in Boston we've got a number of famous formations, you know that are hugely visible everywhere except that the tight locality, you know.
Michael Thonis: But that's where someone did the original work right right.
savrdce@auburn.edu: But getting back Mike to one of your earlier comments about exposures and coastal plain.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Overall, I mean, given our climate in the associated vegetation exposures and the coastal plain are not very good so.
savrdce@auburn.edu: We have some local typically short road cut exposures, but a lot of times we rely on on the rivers and then of course we're, we have to rely on discharge and flooding, and what that does to accessibility.
Michael Thonis: it's just that it's a shame in ways that the places that are close to if if you know the meteor the media or is that.
Michael Thonis: Media right media or if the asteroid is the is the culprit here.
Michael Thonis: which I think you have evidence that it has a role it plays a role in this.
Michael Thonis: It may play a significant role in this it's just a shame that the outcrops are hardest to find right.
Michael Thonis: I mean, even the right, even the asteroid itself is buried, but I mean even but all of these all of these sites that could be.
Michael Thonis: places where they were where they were or large title were large tsunamis may have occurred or not particularly great across.
Michael Thonis: And that's kind of true almost everywhere, I think most of the well I don't want to say i'll just I think that places like Cuba is where you see more evidence of mega tsunami.
Michael Thonis: But it doesn't mean it couldn't have happened were you were you are right.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah how crops are isolated, there are a number of places like brazos river in Texas in several places, and I think northern Mexico that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah we're we have Sam bodies that are dear the case, excuse me.
savrdce@auburn.edu: That are invariably interpreted related to the impact.
Michael Thonis: yeah yeah well.
Rindsberg, Andrew: we're in a much better situation for this and Alabama than we are and and most of the rest of the Gulf remley have more outcrops.
Rindsberg, Andrew: denser a number of decent crops and elsewhere and Compare that to say the lower Chesapeake impact crater.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Only nothing ever.
Rindsberg, Andrew: happened well drilling for.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Now.
Michael Thonis: I should they survived I think they first advised, I think, based on tech tights and then do an analysis of.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Oh that's right.
Michael Thonis: Where they might have come from, and is it Oh, and then drilling supported I don't know actually for sure, which came first, but I think I think it was first just looking at the tech tech field.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Just as an aside.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Several years ago chuck's.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Colleague at auburn David king.
Rindsberg, Andrew: He organized a mini conference on the tonka impact crater of Alabama.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Which is not related to the sheep sulu impact.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Its owners, he yeah he it's still involved as cretaceous but it's older and he brought in people from all over the world, who had studied impact craters and since I lived in Alabama I went.
Michael Thonis: and
Rindsberg, Andrew: Out of curiosity, I asked the participants, how many impact craters have you seen him, you know, everybody said, well, other than the weed tonka crater.
Rindsberg, Andrew: And meteor crater out in Arizona i've seen the only the only other one i've seen is the one that I just just studied, so the Chesapeake people had only seen at most three craters.
Rindsberg, Andrew: yeah ever and since I had been to meteor crater we chunk and.
Rindsberg, Andrew: The whales creek structure in Tennessee I actually was right up there that rare.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Most people it's like people studying ivory big build woodpeckers.
Michael Thonis: yeah it's pretty rare looks like a pretty rare and I think that is the manson one in iowa, I think, which is smaller and then there's that one up in Quebec.
Michael Thonis: The medic medic Coogan is it.
Rindsberg, Andrew: My point is that, if you're studying the tsunami features and most people like like chuck who studied tsunami features have just seen the one.
Rindsberg, Andrew: yeah right Am I correct.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Well, I think I think that's been the issue all along is we we people talk about tsunami deposits and I kind of avoid that term I like mega way better for the katie boundaries.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Because we have.
savrdce@auburn.edu: No modern analogs for the the magnitude of.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The event that occurred at the end of the quotations.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And one of the things that bothered me early on, originally when I was looking at katie boundary Sections I focused on muscle creek and central Alabama and I was convinced it was a thin little insides valley film.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah and so then moved out to Moscow landing and I fell into the trap where whatever these sans even though they're very different than the ones that muscle creek I had to try to pigeonhole them into my preconceived notion of what was going on.
savrdce@auburn.edu: on the opposite side of the coin is because we have no modern analogs people good look at some of these katie boundary deposits in make observations and then interpret them.
savrdce@auburn.edu: In terms of they were free to kind of interpret them in terms of what they perceive was going on in terms of some giant mega.
savrdce@auburn.edu: mega wave event for which they had no matter modern analogues or no way of testing, but after spending more and more time that up Muscat landing I just can't see how you could explain.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Those Sam bodies and other work in any other way than then to say that at least the lower parts of them were in place by some very large no wait.
Sharon Browning: question here, someone who's who seen this site and.
Sharon Browning: At the time, in my career was going to agree with whatever the Professor says i've watched your presentation twice, and I remember, noting an iridium layer in my notes and you didn't mention that in the video, and so I was curious about that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Note there was no I don't think anybody's documented any high concentration of iridium.
At.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Moscow landing if you go to muscle creek and there is a somewhat enrich the iridium layer just above the boundary but it's not a real big spike in it it's in a very, very, very cool oxygenated.
Sharon Browning: Thought i'd missed that.
Sharon Browning: But I had that in my original field notes.
yeah.
Michael Thonis: it's a great question I had wonder, the same thing, I know, though, that iridium you know it is a necessary thing that the iridium be distributed smoothly and evenly across the planet right.
Michael Thonis: It could be and I don't know I don't know whether you've ever ever Is anyone ever founded radium close up to the.
Michael Thonis: You know, to the to the suspect meteor asteroid.
Michael Thonis: In fact isn't it sort of generally associated with some some plays of some sort i'm thinking of the brazos situation and I don't know much about it.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah I mean it was originally discovered in a very fine grain pelagic mud rock that's how the whole thing got started and.
savrdce@auburn.edu: But the one in central Alabama is it just not off the charts and it could easily be explained by very slow sedimentation yeah yeah.
Michael Thonis: So you know, this is a little bit crazy but.
Michael Thonis: But I was thinking about your surfing shrimp and.
Michael Thonis: I actually showed the photo to my wife very cute i'm actually right now in Cape cod and we have we have we don't have shrimp, but we have a lot of borrowing things.
Michael Thonis: crustaceans and mollusks and nothing and nothing really borrows quite as fast as you would need it to and your explanation, but I wondered.
Michael Thonis: If if there was any chance that you have evidence they're not evidence, but.
Michael Thonis: You know the suggestion of maybe that that the that the asteroid had baby to did they were two bodies, you know one right after the other one after a few hours after the other, and then i'd be people have talked about whether any of these bodies are.
Michael Thonis: Fully intact when they hit.
Michael Thonis: And I don't know whether that would have bought you know, maybe they were to sit on two mega.
Michael Thonis: mega waves.
savrdce@auburn.edu: well.
Michael Thonis: That would have bought you enough time for those shrimp to borrow deeply enough.
savrdce@auburn.edu: that's a good question, in fact, when we had submitted the paper.
savrdce@auburn.edu: A couple years ago one of the reviewers comments were you know how do you have enough time if if for those shrimp to do you know the buyer debate those.
savrdce@auburn.edu: interviews and of course they're not completely homogenized is.
savrdce@auburn.edu: There discrete burrows super imposed on laminated sand and, if you look into the literature, there are a variety of papers that described the Berlin rates of certain types of kalyan acid trim and it's highly variable but.
savrdce@auburn.edu: some indication that they might borrow or up to 50 centimeters per hour or something like that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And the other thing, too, is that you got a try to put myself in a shrimp in the body of a shrimp that was just catastrophic Lee.
savrdce@auburn.edu: transported by a mega wave and then lived to tell about it, I would imagine that that would have a significant impact on you know sort of helter skelter what the hell's going on i'm gonna burn really quickly to.
savrdce@auburn.edu: be yes.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And so I think there's enough evidence from the literature of modern shrimpton.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The other side of that story, I should point out is that you know people have modeled the progress.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Of the waves and it wasn't one big mega wave we had these waves oscillating back and forth across the proto Gulf of Mexico.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And I think they indicated that the period one modeling paper that the period would be a bait about eight hours and so maybe there were periods of relative qui essence in between waves that these locks on a set that's what they are these pioneers.
savrdce@auburn.edu: would have maybe an hour or a few hours to actually do the work we seem manifest those The lesson.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Well, I don't think I don't I think this is that was the least plausible part of your your field trip but.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Obviously the birds are there.
Rindsberg, Andrew: An alternative hypothesis might be that they there aren't very many visible vertical shafts and that they are actually.
Rindsberg, Andrew: They conquer and they preferred particular layers within the sand, for some reason, and we know that animals, sometimes do that it would all be it would still be peculiar because.
Rindsberg, Andrew: they're like three basic layers and they have different segments illogical styles.
Rindsberg, Andrew: As you've noticed.
Rindsberg, Andrew: What i'd like to know is.
Rindsberg, Andrew: The one at least the ones toward the top are filled with chalk, so I presume that if micro micro paleontologist.
Rindsberg, Andrew: took scrapings from that they find clayton age material i'd like to know about the lower ones, though.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Right so.
Rindsberg, Andrew: that's festival.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah and that's one of the things that I sorta was alluding to in terms of suggestions toward the end of the of the field trip but what's interesting is in both same body one in six.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The same body six only has the one clearly defined layer and then that's I think equivalent to the upper layer at Sam body one.
savrdce@auburn.edu: You have the penetrating across from the base of the clayton you have planar laminated sandstone that doesn't appear to be disrupted at all.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And then you have an interval that's got more of a marley matrix and then you're back into parallel emanated sans that have the borough.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And so it's my impression that the source horizon may actually be coming out of one of those Marty earlier intervals, which might suggest that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: A little bit of a I don't want to say slack water but qui essence, where we had more time to maybe settle out some of the MIC right that got put into suspension.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Excuse me if, in fact, that was related to to the mega waves, but I agonized in both of those same bodies, whether those were discrete buyer debated horizons and I hope we can get out there.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And look at them together and.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I would be nice.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Because I argued with myself, you know, often and had to convince myself that those were discrete internal buyer debater horizons and.
Rindsberg, Andrew: i've been well looking at your your slides I was planning to just delve into my memory of trying to remember what the field relations were, and it would be so easy to point to it and try to figure it out on on the outcrop yeah.
Rindsberg, Andrew: But they.
Rindsberg, Andrew: See.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Have you taken then sections of the clayton sandstone I know it's pretty friable stuff.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Like we have a we have a few things sections through upward through one of the.
savrdce@auburn.edu: sand bodies now I can't remember which number.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And those samples were taken fairly early before we were actually numbering them.
savrdce@auburn.edu: But they do vary texturally and they also vary significantly, I think the ones in the lower part primarily contain a.
savrdce@auburn.edu: particular topic carbonate cements and then some of the other intervals, are more blocky or, in some cases it's a MIC right matrix summit, so the matrix the green size in the matrix do very.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Through through the units one of the things that I think would be interesting, we we didn't do this is take a closer look at sediment technology, for example.
savrdce@auburn.edu: same body one or any of the same bodies, I mean they're clearly deposition will units.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And it would be interesting to see whether you can actually even though they're discreet Sam bodies, whether you could match up.
savrdce@auburn.edu: texturally or fabric wise, because that would indicate that they're responding to the same.
savrdce@auburn.edu: deposition process in these fault bounded depth of centers as opposed to oh you've got some near shore.
savrdce@auburn.edu: sedimentation going on in these.
savrdce@auburn.edu: flooded areas.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And so I think that's something that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: That that could be done.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Look at a little bit more carefully.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Another queue that I have is if.
Rindsberg, Andrew: The bird is at the top of the co plane, or whatever, whatever you call it.
Rindsberg, Andrew: they're doing much the same thing in the chalk, as they are in the sand and if the sound was loose, then why aren't they doing a few morphing the sand and the last night is in the chalk.
savrdce@auburn.edu: that's.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Why, why are they.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Helping they're reinforcing their versus pay them.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Well it's interesting question the.
savrdce@auburn.edu: There they're clearly differences in overall morphology I think the ones where there's no clayton saying they tend to be more vertical.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And so I would consider those things to represent firm grounds I don't see anything in the ones that are placed in the tops of the same bodies.
savrdce@auburn.edu: It looks like they're just you know plain old the last annoyed ease and placed in a granular sand but getting back to your question is.
savrdce@auburn.edu: If those things are being placed as the shore face migrates landward and the substrates they're being placed in aren't necessarily shifting and characterized by rapid erosion or rapid deposition maybe the crustaceans didn't need to tell it ties the other.
savrdce@auburn.edu: potential problem is that most of the fields of those burrows have been washed out.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah due to high water in the river.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Yes, but you can see the chalk and then, if you look yeah for her.
savrdce@auburn.edu: But, but I have one photograph that I took probably 15 years ago from Sam body six the one at the southern end where it actually so, and this would be in one of these lead internal.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Fire debated horizons, there is one that has fluted engines that look for all the world like it was pelted in the pellets as well as the film were washed out.
savrdce@auburn.edu: But it's only one.
Rindsberg, Andrew: But this brings up another point I hadn't occurred to me until this moment.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Okay you've got a mega wave has just brought in Washington sand and and shrimp the doomed pioneers.
Rindsberg, Andrew: That sand is not fun, no, it does the shrimp couldn't this shrimp or as would have collapsed, but this was saying that had been deposited only hours before.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I don't know why would.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Why would they necessarily collapse, I mean we see a crust the shrimp burrows in.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The last and he's in near shore sans.
Rindsberg, Andrew: These would be sensitive been deposited only hours before it would be fixed Tropic it'd be very.
Rindsberg, Andrew: wet.
savrdce@auburn.edu: well.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I don't know how fix a tropical.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Be that's an interesting point, though, so.
savrdce@auburn.edu: You just don't like my megaliths surfing.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Just looked so normal.
Rindsberg, Andrew: there's too much of them.
Michael Thonis: The sand bodies or or maybe they're if they're fought fall down they might be drink me they may be an orientation to the overall were there, or just coincidentally on this site.
Michael Thonis: The six or four on the site that were there drain where they drain or they may just be dipping the actual the actual fault Valley, the valley created by the faulty maybe just draining you know in some direction and drying fairly quickly.
Rindsberg, Andrew: move would also be under the sea.
Michael Thonis: yeah.
savrdce@auburn.edu: resume.
Michael Thonis: that's right yeah that's right see.
savrdce@auburn.edu: One of the things I mean john Smith, who also interprets the wedge shapes and bodies as as related to mega wave deposition one of the things that he didn't consider.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Is that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: If they pray bluff clayton contact is a sequence boundary.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And if there are no one size valley feels and it's a Co plane or transgressive sequence boundary.
savrdce@auburn.edu: sea level had to a fall sometime before deposition of the clayton sand, and so the question is when the mega waves if assuming mega waves, the positive.
savrdce@auburn.edu: All or parts of the same bodies.
savrdce@auburn.edu: What was the sea level and i'm not saying that prairie bluff had to been severely exposed but sea level had to have fallen in the lake rotations.
Michael Thonis: I was thinking sub Ariel exposed between the between the mega waves, because you know when there's a mega wave it the way it pulls all the water back away from away from the shoreline puts the shoreline way out.
Michael Thonis: It just that's watching videos you know things like that Japan tsunami or the tsunami in the Indian Ocean, where it's just a huge amount of water just disappears goes out 30 miles and then come back with a vengeance.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I don't know we know how.
hard.
Rindsberg, Andrew: i'm sorry I don't think anyone knows truly how high the wave was.
Michael Thonis: No right right i'm just thinking about several possibility and.
Michael Thonis: These these and these shrimp are scrambling to get down to you know below the water table locally.
Michael Thonis: And you've got eight hours to do it, and I know is that I don't know enough about this topic, but does that who knows right.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Not a geophysicist.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Things.
savrdce@auburn.edu: do with it, when the argument became Okay, are these.
savrdce@auburn.edu: mega wave deposits or they thin little in size valley feels I mean insides me how he feels let's say in the western interior, where you had greater substance and more accommodation space they're up to 10s if not hundreds of meters.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The sand bodies are probably no more than two meters stick, but if you.
savrdce@auburn.edu: How do you get an inside Valley, to you, you have sea level fall subfertile exposure and erosion.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And then during the initial transgression.
savrdce@auburn.edu: As base levels rise you fill in those depressions and then the short face comes through well now let's take a mega wave.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The trough of the mega wave hits first so you have withdrawal of the sea.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And then, as the.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The first mega wave comes running through.
savrdce@auburn.edu: You could.
savrdce@auburn.edu: conceivably feel these depressions in this case, they were produced by faulting if we said.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Moscow landing and then.
savrdce@auburn.edu: That erosion will surface at the top could potentially have something to do with the the mega which so to me it's like this the mega wave model could almost.
savrdce@auburn.edu: be a sped up version of a sea levels.
yeah.
Rindsberg, Andrew: yeah.
Rindsberg, Andrew: You could have.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Okay you've got the Sheikh shalhoub impact that's going to generate the granddaddy of all earthquakes, so the faults are formed before the tsunamis hit several hours later.
Michael Thonis: mm hmm yeah they're happening almost simultaneously with that well not simultaneously but pretty quickly after the event, I should I don't know that due to mega waves travel faster than seismic waves I think they travel more slowly, I think.
Michael Thonis: Ours our slogan.
Rindsberg, Andrew: She actually would have been what 900 miles south of here I think about 1000 miles.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I wouldn't hazard a guess have to look at a map.
Michael Thonis: I think that sounds right but you're in your in your geophysicist so you.
Rindsberg, Andrew: said what you said earlier.
Michael Thonis: So how fast would.
Michael Thonis: plus or minus a few hundred miles, what would you know kilometers what would how fast does it take for the seismic the first seismic waves to arrive, not long right.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Hours hours.
Scott Brande: yeah well the the the propagation of.
Scott Brande: Body waves and the crust is somewhere around call it, five, six kilometres per second and.
Scott Brande: The segment of the tsunami waves.
Scott Brande: are only about four to 450 miles an hour so as as Andy said it's it's a huge difference.
Scott Brande: In the transmission time between the head of the seismic wave and the head of the the ocean wave.
Michael Thonis: So the series of events could be the impact, then the huge mega earthquake, you know which breaks up at least the surface, and these are probably semi liquefied right materials right and.
Michael Thonis: And then.
Michael Thonis: And then the next event happens is that the way the water pulls out like a like a regression just pulls way out.
Michael Thonis: And then, and then hours later comes back with a vengeance, and that probably repeats a few times meanwhile the shrimp you know they're like have no idea what's going on right, but all they know is that every time you get a chance, he just borrow down.
Rindsberg, Andrew: well.
Rindsberg, Andrew: there's your walk and get away.
savrdce@auburn.edu: My theory.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I like Superman additional evidence for you some things that you may not have been able to see because I had somewhat different experiences at the side.
Rindsberg, Andrew: But that's.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Instead of poking at your weak point let's i'm going to i'm going to strengthen your already strong point okay.
Rindsberg, Andrew: bear with me i've got more than one point here one of them, the faults, I have more than once, gone down on a boat trip from demonic lists to Moscow landing.
Rindsberg, Andrew: On the Tom baby river at the marvelous the faults are few and displacement is like.
Rindsberg, Andrew: As you go farther South the displacement the faults become more numerous and the displacement displacement gets greater until you get to Moscow landing and virtually every KPMG site now Alabama I don't know about brags but as far as I know, all of the others are faulted.
Rindsberg, Andrew: including some that are now permanently underwater destroyed by eugene Allen Smith in the in the 1800s I can't bluff.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So this these folks are not local.
Rindsberg, Andrew: This you can pretty much assume that the whole coastal plain of Alabama got faulted and I think simultaneously.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Okay, so that's one strengthening piece of evidence, another is the caitlyn the cobbles of chalk.
Rindsberg, Andrew: They are the wrong shape to be formed in local creeks and rivers i've been on many creeks and rivers and Alabama and if that child was anything like the chocolate today, maybe a little less less liquefied it should be shaped in slabs.
Rindsberg, Andrew: They tend to get plucked up in the in the creeks and then moved if they're broken down much further they're not slabs anymore or or blocks or rectangular blocks that are often joint bound rounded.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Rather than these very rounded looking cobbles that you see at Moscow landing, I simply don't believe that there's a river process that could produce that shape of chalk.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So we've got something else, those that truck rolled.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Okay, what we should be looking for is armory of these giant clay balls.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Another feature that some of this chalk day breathe some of it quite course is actually injected down into these faults that Moscow landing.
Rindsberg, Andrew: That means that those faults moved exactly once.
Rindsberg, Andrew: and did not otherwise there's chalk cobbles would today be smeared.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So yes, some of the faults did continue to move in the paleocene I think that's clear, but some of them moved once.
Rindsberg, Andrew: During a disaster.
Scott Brande: And a with regard to those boulders if you will.
Scott Brande: Is there any petrol graphic analysis of the.
Scott Brande: interior of those.
Scott Brande: is just a partners or cobbles.
Scott Brande: versus verte couples versus.
Scott Brande: The matrix which would be within a couple of centimeters outside I mean i'm i'm trying to picture.
Scott Brande: The degree to which.
Scott Brande: The chalk held together.
Scott Brande: In a.
Scott Brande: In a mechanical way.
Scott Brande: As different from the surrounding matrix.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I certainly haven't done any such studies Oh, there was one other thing to notice that was john smith's.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Observation he he found and i'm.
Rindsberg, Andrew: jack has confirmed that there were three main pebble to cut cobbled two double beds there, they are finding upwards, each one it's as if there was a way there's another wave and he had a third wave, how many more ways we don't know.
Rindsberg, Andrew: But as far as cryptography goes.
Rindsberg, Andrew: it's an open field.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And it's interesting too, because in some of those wedge shaped bodies it's clear that there was a fault scarf.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And those class were more or less being check that probably coming over the top, but those the work and glamour attic intervals, then, can shout generally to the north, depending what Sam body are looking looking at so they're probably all sorts of other things that could be.
savrdce@auburn.edu: done to try to fill in.
savrdce@auburn.edu: In.
Rindsberg, Andrew: This important.
Rindsberg, Andrew: there's there's not another outcrop it's so expensive that shows all these features.
Sharon Browning: For saving, I want to get out to Moscow landing again anytime this year.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Maybe.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I haven't been out there now and and probably over a year.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Colvin.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And the property situation kind of hit I was under the impression that the.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And Andy clarified this at the beginning of our session but I had the misunderstanding that property lines or high water.
savrdce@auburn.edu: mark and also there is a the gas pipeline that goes through the River there's a an access for utility and thinking that that was also public right away, and as Andy described before.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I was wrong, it had been trespass.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And so I think if we make the right connections Andy has already started and.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I may try to introduce myself and.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Give them a glossy.
savrdce@auburn.edu: balloon up map strip napa there shoreline maybe that would use a dad of the call the COPs and say how did you do this with that trespassing them I.
Michael Thonis: don't have the sweet occupies of that one.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Well, I when I talked to him, like, I had a field trip and co and he said, what are you doing here.
Rindsberg, Andrew: There I was at the bridge and we had quite a discussion I he left he, let us go.
Rindsberg, Andrew: But I think mostly it was his honor that was being that he was thinking about he does, I don't think he really cares about all these field trips, as long as people ask for permission ahead time.
Michael Thonis: Was, you know as long as you know, find a whole a whole tire and osiris fossil you know in there because that's that's out West right wyoming in.
Rindsberg, Andrew: The code and that would be the kiss of death.
Michael Thonis: yeah nobody.
Michael Thonis: will know rancher will it just doesn't happen anymore, they will not give you access on the properties.
Sharon Browning: But I wonder to about a liability issue because, if I remember that.
Sharon Browning: Ben riverbank can be pretty slippery.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Sometimes, yes yeah he was.
Rindsberg, Andrew: He was concerned about.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I wrote a handwritten liability waiver and.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Had everyone sign it on the spot.
Yes, that better.
Michael Thonis: picture, do you have a do you have a.
Michael Thonis: Full a composite of photographs of the I can't remember I don't think I saw that in the video of your strip map, but you have.
Michael Thonis: Like you know what I mean a panorama.
savrdce@auburn.edu: know.
savrdce@auburn.edu: When I first started working out their digital cameras or.
Michael Thonis: yeah yeah.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And in order to try to sketch what we were seeing we dragged a canoe down there and I took an old polaroid camera.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And as we floated down the river right, and so, and then what we did was put overlays on that sketched it so that the geometry is a little distorted but.
savrdce@auburn.edu: We have some cross sectional view sketches that we've done but.
savrdce@auburn.edu: It would have been neat to do a you know, to get a drone out there.
Michael Thonis: Well, I was just thinking about my museum of science, you know how that would make a great Ural.
Michael Thonis: In health people understand get us, you know it, you know, point out that we don't know sure what happened, but one possibility is.
Michael Thonis: As supported, partly by this panorama this mural is the following story which I just think it's kind of you know you always wanting to museum to be as scintillating as possible yeah.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Well, given the scale and the length of minutes, one point Gomez two kilometers long and and the outcrops Andy what maximum five meters in any one place if you.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Had a whole panorama you wouldn't be able to see.
Michael Thonis: No, but you know what these digital which you can do with these digital photos, as you can change the scales, you know, however, often the trial set.
savrdce@auburn.edu: stretch it out.
Michael Thonis: Well, you know the Cross section, you might have you know five X.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah.
Michael Thonis: On the vertical you can do that, you can actually do that with a with you know by digitizing it.
Michael Thonis: And i've seen actually were there's a name for it, but the you can take separate photos and then using software stitch them together like you're just one.
Michael Thonis: Like one large panoramic photo it's got huge detail, you know the pixels are terrific.
Sharon Browning: Are you talking about like a giga pan.
Michael Thonis: yeah good Japan that's it, thank you, the giga pan yeah that that technology.
Van Burbach: i'm gonna have to.
Michael Thonis: deal.
With thanks.
Michael Thonis: So that would you know you can really grateful i'm just i'm just thinking of maybe maybe i'll make contact you at some point.
Michael Thonis: and go on a field trip with you and we'll get all the right permissions.
Rindsberg, Andrew: That would be so wonder.
Rindsberg, Andrew: It should be done on a.
Rindsberg, Andrew: On a day when the river is flat so.
Michael Thonis: Low.
Rindsberg, Andrew: The drones you're right with drones you wouldn't matter with it.
Rindsberg, Andrew: wow.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Well, I think it'd be hard to settle the issue of the mega wave surfing shrimp using a drone I think.
savrdce@auburn.edu: We need to get our nose right on.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The good.
Scott Brande: hey chuck i'm going to have to go shortly, but I just wanted to bring back, maybe a memory that I have held strongly since 1996 and specifically in May and you might You might remember whoops, how can I do this.
Sharon Browning: Virtual background.
Scott Brande: Yes, buddy oh there it is.
Michael Thonis: Okay dad dinosaurs.
Scott Brande: dead dead dead dinosaurs right, and this is when yeah i'll see if I can get this this is when Walter Alvarez came to Alabama for his one.
Scott Brande: Guided field trip with you, and what I did is since a friend of mine was writing for the burnham news Jeff handsome.
Scott Brande: came along on the trip and I brought to Birmingham City school teachers and so we had a wonderful time with you as you were leading one of your your local field trips down there may may of 1996.
Scott Brande: And and Alvarez apparently enjoyed it greatly at that time.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Are you are you talking to Andy.
Scott Brande: No i'm talking.
Scott Brande: i'm talking to you chuck.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Oh well, i'll take credit for, but I think I would Alvarez, on a future down there so.
Scott Brande: yeah well.
Scott Brande: well.
Sharon Browning: shoemaker.
Scott Brande: It definitely.
Rindsberg, Andrew: wasn't me.
Michael Thonis: well.
savrdce@auburn.edu: crowded Charlie Charlie Smith navy.
Scott Brande: Was Charlie the one who argued against.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Yes.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Yes, and he's he's a nano expert.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I don't know what he's doing now, but he says that eventually he wants his ashes, to be spread at Moscow.
Scott Brande: Oh good Lord.
Scott Brande: well.
Scott Brande: In any case, i've got the head off, but thanks for the incredible graphics and the photographs as well chuck so I really appreciate it.
Michael Thonis: Thanks, thank you, thank you chuck i'm gonna go to thank you.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Mike Thank you.
Rindsberg, Andrew: well.
Sharon Browning: But preserving, it is an issue because I remember seeing the ups site just off of air base boulevard and and that's gone now because it took that CAP rock for the zoo and that meat or scale cross stratification that was preserved there yeah I think it was the utah formation.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah the topic be saying.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Suddenly, so the River outcrops are.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Self renewing in a way, I mean it's a subtracted process, the fact is, you can go there many times and see something different, every time you go.
Oh, you.
savrdce@auburn.edu: know the.
savrdce@auburn.edu: you're talking about preservation, I thought, what this may be a harebrained idea and Andy I think you were highly involved in the what is the Union Chapel mind is that the right.
Rindsberg, Andrew: One time yes.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah in terms of getting that preserved.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Is that state property now right.
Rindsberg, Andrew: It is.
savrdce@auburn.edu: i'm just wondering whether we could figure out a way of preserving a strip of the Moscow landing section.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Through a similar type of effort.
Rindsberg, Andrew: It would be very different the Union Chapel mine was.
Rindsberg, Andrew: A whole line of being shot.
Rindsberg, Andrew: down, so the.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Congress had to had to interfere, because it was because there was a federal law sayings inactive minds, have to be covered over again.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So they had to make an exception, we got support from at her fault, one of our State Representatives.
Rindsberg, Andrew: This and it was private property, and then I.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I don't know how much money the other owners were given that they got something from the state I don't know how we've managed to do this in this.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Is yeah I thought there was some sort of fundraising effort that actually.
Rindsberg, Andrew: got better was.
savrdce@auburn.edu: It to some degree, this could potentially be simpler, because you don't have the coal mining regulation.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And it's kind of like you know just up to the edge of the woods, what are they going to do at that those nicely exposed products.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And then they wouldn't have to worry about liability and it could be, it could be administered similar to the way the Herald station, or something like that is where it's through University of Alabama or something like that so.
savrdce@auburn.edu: So there is some control on accessed but.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And there be some sort of central clearing house or something that that let people in or gotten lucky or whatever, but.
Rindsberg, Andrew: You who operates as a sumter county nature trust on.
Rindsberg, Andrew: And through that they operate.
Rindsberg, Andrew: A site on the River on an old bluff part it actually includes the type locality of the bluff part our own, although that was not their intention it's an archaeological site and it includes the laughs along the river, I could look into that and see how that was done.
Rindsberg, Andrew: And that would be one avenue you.
Rindsberg, Andrew: could also see that we could.
Rindsberg, Andrew: go through the nature conservancy.
Rindsberg, Andrew: which has a huge amount of experience in talking with landowners and soothing their ruffled feathers and.
Rindsberg, Andrew: And sometimes leaving land in their hands, but within a kind of an easement.
Rindsberg, Andrew: That.
Rindsberg, Andrew: restrict certain kind of usage they do this with.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Oh endangered plants, for instance.
Rindsberg, Andrew: so that you know they might have an easement on a field and say you can hunt there all you like just just don't.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Just don't plow it and use it for crops, you know.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I guess if I was the property owner, I think that my biggest issue is one that Sharon mentioned was is the liability.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And so you know you you filled out those had students sign it, but you know i've been told by lawyers that you know.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Laughter have some that may not be worth the paper they're written on.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Why do we have them.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Question just to make us feel better.
savrdce@auburn.edu: My understanding is.
Sharon Browning: due diligence.
savrdce@auburn.edu: My understanding is and I got a contact Nick to our state geologist who was the one that.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Supposedly it's been communicating with the property owner, in the meantime early on, when I found out about the issue of access.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I had a draft our people here are legal folks put together a draft and that might be something that I need to show the property owner to see whether that would suffice, but I know they've been communicating with the lawyers themselves about the liability issue and so.
savrdce@auburn.edu: they're they're not just.
savrdce@auburn.edu: now know off the cuff well we're concerned somebody might get hurt they're communicating bleak with legal counsel about it.
Sharon Browning: Well, one other completely different topic question here, and then I have to go, do you see that I could see this easily being used for for undergraduates have you have you thought about I think I think this field trip is supposed to be made available on GSA website.
Sharon Browning: Is that correct.
savrdce@auburn.edu: audrey I don't know whether she's still listening.
savrdce@auburn.edu: We were, I was asking about that, before.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Apparently, this will remain in what archive for a year, so that anybody.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Who registered already can go back and access, it is that correct or somebody could register for the meeting.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Post meeting and access whatever recordings obsessions and field trips is that accurate.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: yep so so like anything on the meeting that we've recorded is going to be available for up to a year and then.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: you're since it was a pre recorded field trip we're actually going to archive that on the GSA website behind a member of a member wall.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: for however long i'm not quite sure, since this is a new process for GSA we're still trying to figure out kind of that process so.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: I think there's for field trips from the southeast meeting that agreed to have it archives we're still trying to figure out exactly what that looks like and what does that mean.
savrdce@auburn.edu: You know, one of the things early on, when I was trying to design a trip, I was trying to break it into segments where you would show part of it, and then say okay students.
savrdce@auburn.edu: What did you just hear draw cross section and using strategy graphic principal sequence of events, try to figure out what's going on.
savrdce@auburn.edu: But I think you still could introduce things the basic things like strata graphic principles and that sort of thing using polar parts of the trip, so if it's archived as long as somebody's a member, even though they weren't registered for the meeting, they would be able to access.
savrdce@auburn.edu: At least for.
Sharon Browning: myself thinking and in a way, I never imagined we've developed all this online content for our students and.
Sharon Browning: And some of it is is really good and I don't see getting rid of it, especially for field experiences.
Sharon Browning: Okay, I have.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: Yet and there's even then talk just you know kind of going forward with field trips, should we be sending professional photographers or videographers out there and really capturing everything that's a lot more money, but that is kind of the talk of like.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: Is this.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: Where are we going like what we you know covert hit we're dealing with it, how can we kind of continue to maybe.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: make things better.
Sharon Browning: Thank you very much.
savrdce@auburn.edu: No.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Thank you, sharing, that was a great question.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Well, you know discovering Alabama does have does does send out professionals into the field to do just very similarly thanks, but they're not doing it it's such a technical level, as you are checking.
Rindsberg, Andrew: So I think would be that would be wonderful if you could.
Rindsberg, Andrew: If you could get in touch with them with discovering Alabama Doug Phillips.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah I can do with Doug Phillips, and took the sands of time, the mighty Tom big me river here flows southward across the coastal plain.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Until it flowed backward and the great tsunami yeah.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Maybe that's the voice, I should have done the field trip.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: To say where's the British British accent.
Rindsberg, Andrew: What will know that you're doing.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Real detailed work chuck when you tell us what season of the year, it happened in.
Rindsberg, Andrew: i'll bet you can do it with if you look careful attention to the oyster growth lines.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Actually, until I said it, I hadn't realized, it is actually possible.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Well, that would make a great article in nature.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Yes, yes, you draft it up send it to me and i'll add my part.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Right any any other questions comments I think we've we've gone over and I don't know what time is the closing remarks that bill haynes's.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: I have to arrive at 425 mountain time, I think it starts at 545 central time okay.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Any other questions comments so Terry john.
savrdce@auburn.edu: So.
John Fronimos: chuck I didn't have a lot of insights not being a.
John Fronimos: You know somebody who does a lot with trace fossils but I did have.
John Fronimos: One question I imagine you probably would have mentioned it if you'd seen something like this, when you talk about the you know the surfing shrimps and that sort of thing.
John Fronimos: I immediately pictured you know here one of those shrimps that gets you know mixed up in the settlement and buried, would you see any signs of you know escaped traces or anything like that those.
John Fronimos: persist in this type of stuff.
savrdce@auburn.edu: that's a real good question um My guess is that the shrimp probably we're.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Assuming that that's how they were in placed okay.
savrdce@auburn.edu: They were probably more part of a suspended load than, although that Sam was probably in suspension to i'm just guessing that the sand might have come down before they the floating bodies of shrimp but.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I don't know that's a interesting interesting point.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Most of the time when you see escape structures they're usually produced by something that was already on the sea floor or when you had rapid deposition.
savrdce@auburn.edu: But something like this probably would have had a lot of erosion prior to deposition and would have re suspended, you know just looking at regular storm deposits in the trace fossils.
savrdce@auburn.edu: You would think you would find a lot more escape structures and then but I don't hardly ever seen him and I think it's because the base of the V San are typically sharp and original and either the current or the wave energy has reached suspended.
savrdce@auburn.edu: The mud, and probably organisms.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And then eventually you get the sand and then you have things fall out, you know the finer grain tail of the event, so I don't see a lot of I don't see any escape structures, although.
savrdce@auburn.edu: it's kind of hard to see in these buyers for beta intervals, specifically in the quake sans good vertical.
savrdce@auburn.edu: profile, so there are a few places where you can.
Rindsberg, Andrew: I did look at the vertical profiles and I don't remember seeing any escape structures.
Rindsberg, Andrew: or anything except for the last invitees.
Right.
savrdce@auburn.edu: What do you think about that audrey you buy in the mega wave surfing shrimp where's he going with Andy.
Rindsberg, Andrew: i'm just being skeptical i'm not saying.
savrdce@auburn.edu: i'm just trying to spot.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: These surfing transom quite interesting.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Well, I didn't mention that we found the surfboards about that big it's.
savrdce@auburn.edu: evolved been lignin ties, but.
savrdce@auburn.edu: In board with to read oh.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: Yes, i'm making me hungry.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: I.
Rindsberg, Andrew: guess i'm far from time to throw in the towel chuck Bravo, this was an excellent field trip video and the next Q amp a.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And I think you helped make it that way, because you've been there and had a lot to add, I appreciate it, but let's get out there sometime.
Rindsberg, Andrew: vantage this summer i've been vaccinated.
savrdce@auburn.edu: I second one I got two weeks i'll get started.
savrdce@auburn.edu: In the water should be down.
Rindsberg, Andrew: yeah summer.
Rindsberg, Andrew: home resting there in the summer, but.
Rindsberg, Andrew: But to see the only good time to go.
Rindsberg, Andrew: to slip on.
Rindsberg, Andrew: That truck really is slick.
yeah.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: So thank you.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: audrey yeah.
RISE GSA Audrey Heun: Thank you fun working with you on this stuff.
savrdce@auburn.edu: yeah thanks all of you guys at GSA it's.
savrdce@auburn.edu: It seemed painless well thanks.
John Fronimos: truck I wanted to say thank you being being new to the area, you know coming here this past year and still getting a feel for you know the.
John Fronimos: locals photography and geology and things I was a great primer on a lot of them both the first photography and the the general the specific things that make this outcrop so interesting.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Good Where are you located.
John Fronimos: So i'm here at auburn now i'm a lecture on the department, but I just got hired this past fall mean down from vassar and so i'm crash coursing myself and.
John Fronimos: You know I always like to get a feel for this retainer fee as fast as I can but it's sort of yeah.
savrdce@auburn.edu: very long on retired in June, when I did run Louis.
savrdce@auburn.edu: And he's been really hiding.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Know darn you you move.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Across country and during the pandemic and set up a new office and all everything.
John Fronimos: That was interesting it was interesting.
John Fronimos: It was probably about.
John Fronimos: A little earlier than this last year that I was interviewing I was supposed to come down to auburn and then suddenly they said hey we're not traveling anymore rob you know reasons that we're quickly becoming obvious a.
John Fronimos: little bit different from other other moves i've done.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Well you're better off than the you who the biologists who almost became a member of our faculty our our hiring process just collapsed.
John Fronimos: Right after I you know got this position, the.
John Fronimos: You know, seeing that the job listing sort of dry up and things.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Well we're glad you're here john.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Welcome to Alabama.
John Fronimos: Thanks i'm glad to be here glad to circuit and know the area.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Okay.
John Fronimos: So you actually get.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Along with when chuck.
Rindsberg, Andrew: comes together let's go come along.
John Fronimos: i'm glad to come along on any any outing I can get.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Well, I hope everybody has a good Easter weekend yeah I gotta go home and eat fish.
Rindsberg, Andrew: Good fish.
Rindsberg, Andrew: good night everyone.
savrdce@auburn.edu: Thanks, for attending. savrdce@auburn.edu: Thanks, for attending.