RISE Jennifer Nocerino: i'll how about I wonder if we should just go ahead and get going.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: And I have a feeling that with cj working with Jim we should have this resolved in no time, so why don't we go ahead and get started, and that way.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: We can keep working on resolving everything in the background, so, first of all, I just want to welcome everyone to the john man mentors and applied hydro geology Program.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: And, as I said, we're still just.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: resolving a couple of technical issues, but I think we will be there and no time.
13345468004: So, Robert can you hear me, yes, I can.
13345468004: yay i'm so glad it worked out, thank you.
13345468004: Thank you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Alright, so Oh, and the other thing Jim you might turn off your sound on your computer screen otherwise you'll get a feedback when you have both your phone and the computer screen not muted.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: So, once again, let me just welcome us to the john man mentors program and I do want to mention that this is a GSA events, and we are using our rise code of conduct so we're i'm asking you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: To be respectful inclusive.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: And to act.
responsibly.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: And with that i'd like to turn it over to vicki mcconnell, which is our GSA executive director for a couple of quick introductions.
Vicki McConnell: hi everyone on.
Vicki McConnell: It.
Vicki McConnell: In so my.
Vicki McConnell: My first part of this is just.
Vicki McConnell: To.
Vicki McConnell: say a bunch of thank yous I want to thank Jennifer know serena for be.
Vicki McConnell: Being the program manager for.
Vicki McConnell: The for these mentor meetings and lunches and everything she.
Vicki McConnell: Does a really great job, and so I sometimes neglect to give a shout out to you Jennifer.
Vicki McConnell: But thank you and she is a big part of this because she finds all of these.
13345468004: awesome mentors.
Vicki McConnell: For you, the students to have an opportunity to.
Vicki McConnell: to interact with.
Vicki McConnell: On.
Vicki McConnell: And so.
Vicki McConnell: that's my second Thank you is to thank all the mentors for taking some time out of their meeting and out of the day.
Vicki McConnell: To do.
Vicki McConnell: To meet with.
Vicki McConnell: Students that are interested in on GEO hydrology and applied.
Vicki McConnell: geology activities and careers it's it's a it's a great direction it's it's the direction I went in my career so not the duck the geo not the hydro part, but the applied part I think it's really, really keen and really important.
Vicki McConnell: On and then the last part that i'll just mention is, these are the kind of programs it in and debbie Martin calcio bring this up a little bit too, but these are the kinds of programs that professional societies do for their their members it's really important.
Vicki McConnell: We see our mission as both.
13345468004: Disseminating.
Vicki McConnell: The science of geoscience in a way that it that it's useful and again can be both.
Vicki McConnell: Research and employment, but we also see the real importance of building careers through the through your whole career she started as a student.
Vicki McConnell: and work your way up through a you're going to have a lot of decision points and there's going to be a lot of times when being in a professional society.
Vicki McConnell: gives you.
Vicki McConnell: Networking capability ability to publish it gives you all kinds of ways that you can work with with developing your career, so please take advantage of that.
Vicki McConnell: i'd love to see you stay as GSA members that's really super some of you may go off and other very specific directions and you find another professional society, so you can join them too, but stick with GSA is what else.
Vicki McConnell: So just thanks everyone I don't want to take up any more your time because we're running a little late already do take advantage students of talking with these mentors asking the hard questions that's what they're here for Thank you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thanks so much vicki I appreciate it and debbie What would you like, let me introduce you i'm sorry.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: This is debbie marston cascade she's with GSA foundation which takes care of the funds for all of these programs.
Debora Marcinkowski: hi everyone nice to see all of you so on behalf of the Foundation, I just want to welcome all of you, and let you know that we are the arm that helps fund programs like this and others for students, if we were in person, I would invite you to come to our GSA foundation.
Debora Marcinkowski: booth because we are a.
Debora Marcinkowski: lot of information about other programs for students, like our graduate student research grants on to the future.
Debora Marcinkowski: Some expanding representation in the geoscience scholarship so lots of things to tell you about, and if you have any questions about other student programs, you can always ask Jennifer or.
Debora Marcinkowski: My way but Jennifer would be your first to go to there so programs like this are funded by really generous donors to the GSA foundation and Dr john man was a longtime Member.
Debora Marcinkowski: Obviously, a hydrogeologist himself in the applied sector and Members like him have been really committed to encouraging students to pursue careers in the geosciences and so see fit to contribute significantly for programs like this to go on in perpetuity.
Debora Marcinkowski: So that's how these programs.
Debora Marcinkowski: are funded and able to happen for people like Jennifer to carry them out, and so just a reminder to, of course, hopefully you'll maintain your membership with us, and there are a lot of ways that you might also think about contributing yourself.
Debora Marcinkowski: Whether it's coming back as a mentor.
For future programs.
Debora Marcinkowski: Maybe he donating a bit, we have a great student donor group believe it or not, we have almost 1200 GSA student Members who donate it's a group called tectonics.
Debora Marcinkowski: building the future.
Debora Marcinkowski: We have a fun little gift for any student donors and it requires a very small contribution to be a part of that So hopefully we'll see you all again thanks guys.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thanks so much debbie I appreciate that.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Alright, so i'd like to now move on to our mentors and Edwin Andrews is not with us today, but Randy kath actually hopped in, and so I think I will ask him to introduce himself as well, so Jim would you like to start.
13345468004: Oh sure.
13345468004: Welcome to my very messy Office, my name is TIM Keller i'm amanda geosciences staff in the groundwater branch of the Alabama department of environmental management and i'm happy to say, I recently completed my 25th and them here never thought I would be here this one.
13345468004: fun fact and i'll digress briefly, I never thought I would ever ever.
13345468004: Do hydrogeologist, in fact, if you had asked me at the start of my career, would I consider hydrogeologist a vocation, I would have said no Absolutely not.
13345468004: And that being kept being said, you know I just I had a terrible experience as an undergraduate by taking a hydro geology course and they just totally turn me off on the subject, you know my passion is really.
13345468004: paleontology and I pursued that, but when I finished my graduate degree.
13345468004: I graduated into a recession and I didn't have a lot of flexibility, and in my career choices, so I ended up at the Alabama department of environmental management, they were the only.
13345468004: place that was really hiring and I was living in the southeast, and so I packed up my suitcase and moved to Montgomery.
13345468004: A little bit about my education, I did my undergraduate at rockers college records university and then I worked a little bit in industry and then I ended up pursuing a master's degree at the University of Tennessee and uh and then the rest is history 25 years later, here I am.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: sorry about that I was typing in the chat I apologize.
13345468004: So.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thank you very much, Jim I appreciate that and Eric Johnson, would you like to introduce yourself.
Eric Johnson: well.
Eric Johnson: My name is Eric Johnson, I have a slightly somewhat important title, although.
Eric Johnson: I do a director geology for company called ws P USA, where a consulting and engineering company with offices in the US and overseas.
Eric Johnson: My.
Eric Johnson: I guess career path at least starting off.
Eric Johnson: Is sounds very similar to gyms and that I went to graduate school at rutgers college in new brunswick and graduated there and then.
Eric Johnson: I went to graduate school right after that the University of Tennessee knoxville.
Eric Johnson: And graduated from there.
Eric Johnson: Give the date but it's a little while ago and.
Eric Johnson: When I like maybe Jim was experiencing when I was completing my graduate education, the job market somewhat was.
13345468004: A little lean for geologists.
Eric Johnson: And when I was finishing up I had an opportunity with my advisor.
Eric Johnson: To be able to do a little bit of what you might call from.
13345468004: Consulting work jonjo consulting.
Eric Johnson: work which pretty much just involved geologic.
13345468004: mapping.
Eric Johnson: And some errors in East Tennessee.
13345468004: And from there, I.
Eric Johnson: was able to get a job.
Eric Johnson: With a small kind of company that did a mix of environmental consulting and some other engineering work up in the Washington DC area and from there went to work shortly after joining that company, about a year later, with a bigger company.
Eric Johnson: That just had a lot more.
13345468004: Opportunities for.
Eric Johnson: Doing geologic geological work both in the eastern us pretty much all over, and so I moved to that company and that's kind of who i've stayed with for the last.
Eric Johnson: 30 plus years and just kind of worked my way up the quote unquote ladder, so to speak up in the environmental consulting our company's been under various different names.
13345468004: In this industry is such that.
Eric Johnson: Companies get bought join forces more with time and so.
13345468004: company was when I first started out probably six or seven.
Eric Johnson: For the company, since I joined up and very my I guess career, I just started out doing technical work, a lot of field or.
Eric Johnson: sample collection of data evaluation and analysis and as we started to work my way up and through the company started to get more into that's a task management involved in.
13345468004: Really, yes I guess.
Eric Johnson: Major activities.
Eric Johnson: Planning scoping executing completing and then eventually what I do now is more kind of have like a project management that's a role with also providing some technical support for other projects and other things going on with the company so.
Eric Johnson: that's pretty much my.
Eric Johnson: background, in a nutshell.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Wonderful thanks so much Eric I appreciate that and Randy CAP is with us and Randy would you like to introduce yourself.
Randy Kath: Sure i'll give you a brief introduction Randy cat a professor in geology of the University of West Georgia.
Randy Kath: Prior to teaching at the university I worked in gold exploration for about eight and a half years, and the Western United States since coming to the university I have now been there, as my 26 year it's hard to believe.
Randy Kath: And I also am the academic coordinator for as Bob and for many of the students you'll understand licensure many of our States require licensure.
Randy Kath: And i've been working with as bug since 2007 also sit on the Georgia board for professional genealogists if you come to Georgia and get licensed i'll probably be reviewing your license application.
Randy Kath: So if you have any questions about licensure and certification in different states, be happy to answer any of those questions for you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thanks so much Randy I appreciate that, so our program is run entirely by student questions, we do have a few students in here we've done some introductions So if you have questions go ahead and type those in.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: I would like to spend just a moment talking about certification so i'm going to put Randy and Jim on the spot very quickly.
13345468004: And a lot of.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Students are not familiar with certification to.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: become a professional genealogist and for the students who are with us, will you type into the chat box, if you are familiar with certification or not just so that we know.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: But it is really important for you to become aware of, and I try to spend a little bit of time talking about it, and all of our mentor programs.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: So Randy do you mind saying a couple words about certification and why it's important and then perhaps Jim you could say a word or two after Randy.
Randy Kath: Sure Jennifer can I share my screen is that.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Sure, let me see if I can i'll do a stop share on me.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Okay, then you should see a share screen green button at the.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: bottom, it should be a green button that says share screen.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: yeah awesome.
Randy Kath: yeah so Jim and I have worked.
Randy Kath: Before at.
Randy Kath: Some of these mentoring luncheons for.
Randy Kath: GSA tag team these before if you want to work in one of these green states these states have licensed your laws and it's in the Statute and if.
Randy Kath: You.
Randy Kath: Have public practice.
Randy Kath: Of geology in any of these green states, you have to have a life.
Randy Kath: Many of the States exempt state and federal workers.
Randy Kath: But that's starting to go away to the usgs is starting to require certification and corps of engineers is starting to require certification.
Randy Kath: Of the States that are in blue Michigan and iowa they do not have state license your laws, but they do allow you to take fundamentals of geology examination.
Randy Kath: So your path to licensure is first you'll need to get a degree in geology or geological engineering or geosciences or something.
Randy Kath: of that nature and then you take the first examination that's required by the States and green and that's called the fundamentals of geology exam and the fundamentals of geology exam is very.
Randy Kath: comprehensive examination, it will cover pretty much everything you did as an undergraduate in geology.
Randy Kath: So I highly recommend that you take that examination as soon as you get out of school.
Randy Kath: You don't want to get down the road 1015 years and then have to come back into the fundamentals because you've probably forgotten, a lot of those fundamentals as you've started to be more of a practitioner and get more specialized in what you do.
Randy Kath: Once you get experience after you pass the fundamentals of geology exam many States require anywhere from four to seven years work experience under a P professional engineer or professional geologists.
Randy Kath: And then you come back and you take a second examination, which is called the practice of geology examination and when you pass that examination most states will give you a license.
Randy Kath: And one one of the big advantages of licensure of all these green states is you have mobility of your license.
Randy Kath: So, for instance, if I was an undergraduate and I took the fundamentals of geology in Georgia, where i'm at.
Randy Kath: And I ended up moving out to Oregon I can take the practice of geology exam in Oregon and become licensed in Oregon and then, if I want to move to maine and get a license there.
Randy Kath: All I do is apply to the main board and they see that i'm already have a license by examination and experience in the main board.
Randy Kath: Of course, will make you pay some dollars and then you'll be licensed in maine and then 10 years down the road, I might want to move to Texas and Texas will recognize that as bug license as well, so it's a really advantageous for you to.
Randy Kath: take the first step to licensure and take fundamentals, the geology examination as soon as you can when you get out of school.
Randy Kath: And then that after you get your work experience take that second examination.
Randy Kath: Now i'm university professor and i'm exempt I don't have to be licensed but i'm licensed in four states, because I do the public practice of geology, so I do consulting work and other work.
Randy Kath: Outside the university and I really think it's important for your careers to start your path to license your by taking that first examination.
Randy Kath: Okay i'll give it back to you Jennifer.
13345468004: Others to share screen work.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: So down at the bottom, you have our.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: could be at the top it'll be.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: A green share screen button.
13345468004: Right.
13345468004: yeah we didn't show up on your monitor.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Would you like to share.
13345468004: With Microsoft came here.
13345468004: No problem.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: i'll stop the share of my screen and then Jim you should be able to see a green share screen.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: button across the bottom or the top where you have your control panel.
13345468004: Okay, what do I do now, I get a window that.
13345468004: yeah so you click the one you want to share and then you click the.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Share button after that.
13345468004: yeah let's try that and while.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: he's bringing that up I did put in some information for the students or anyone who wants to attend GSA will be doing.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: A webinar on certification we actually have someone who recently got.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: The GI T and someone who recently got a PG and so they're there to answer questions and and help folks.
13345468004: and
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: I promise we'll get back to you soon Eric I apologize you're welcome to add a.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: few moments, or a few comments about certification if you'd like as well, please.
Eric Johnson: I can do that, first of all, I could definitely second randy's recommendation as far as taking the fundamentals of geology exam as soon as you get out of school because I was in that group or did not take the exam until about 10 to 15 years.
13345468004: afterwards.
Eric Johnson: and, believe me, I had to spend a lot of time.
Eric Johnson: Going back and reviewing relearning things like mineralogy metrology structural geology best.
13345468004: Areas that.
Eric Johnson: In my professional career, I wasn't really using that much, and so I and like clarity mentioned it's a very comprehensive exam on demand, and so you really need to know a lot of that information.
Eric Johnson: To be able to do well in that exam also kind of a plug for GSA a lot of states have what they call continuing education require.
Eric Johnson: And so on a lot of those involved, maybe participation in conferences or meetings like as a separate from each.
Eric Johnson: Other you know, maybe webinars or any other I guess vehicle or or event that that essentially helps you grow your knowledge base where all your understanding heidrick theology geologic principles to chemistry things of that nature.
Eric Johnson: Because some States don't have it, but a lot of them do I think some states.
13345468004: Are.
Eric Johnson: are starting to go to that a little bit.
Eric Johnson: More, and so I think students staying involved in organizations like GSA and other ones like that is a really good idea because it will just help you be able to fulfill those continuing education requirements when you eventually get your PG.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thank you very much, I appreciate that and Jim, we can see your screen so feel free.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: To add some.
comments.
13345468004: Oh, thanks, if you might remember this from 2019 I I let a Randy and I lead a licensure workshop over in charleston.
13345468004: And I totally concur with Eric I remember having to study for the ass blog has been out of college for probably.
13345468004: Eight years at that point, you know, and it was and when you're working full time it is, it is a real drain.
13345468004: So if you have the opportunity to take that F G as soon as you can like maybe during your senior year or following graduation, please do so, you know do it, while that that information is fresh in your mind.
13345468004: Randy pretty much touched on everything pertinent to ask Bob, I just wanted to say that.
13345468004: yeah licensure is important because, when you're working within the public domain, your clients, or maybe a government agency, you know they're they're expecting you to.
13345468004: produce a product that that you know you can defend the veracity and interpretation of that results and, though, and so, when you apply your professional stamper seal to that document.
13345468004: You know your your ascertaining its its validity.
13345468004: And so licensure I think does a lot to promote responsibility within the profession, as well as accountability.
13345468004: i'll skip this part because you know I think that's pretty.
13345468004: Just just for the second time.
13345468004: But I want to talk a little bit about career opportunities, and so this this comes back this goes back to that 2019.
13345468004: But talk I get i'm sure the the statistics have changed since then, but you know, as you can see your Bureau of Labor statistics does suggest that there is rather robust.
13345468004: job growth in the geoscientist profession, and I would argue hydro geology is really relevant, particularly in those States here in the southeast where you're seeing a burgeoning population growth Tennessee Florida.
13345468004: You know, really, really stellar growth if you're living in the north and you're retiring you know you're migrating down South in Tennessee for the carolinas are popular destinations for that.
13345468004: Alabama is seeing a surge and growth in some municipalities, particularly Huntsville Alabama it's poised to be the largest municipality, and the state this year it will it will eclipse the city of Birmingham.
13345468004: So this expansion and.
13345468004: You know, and some of these cities, you know, requires a lot of.
13345468004: Planning and engineering, particularly for public works and and I would argue, water resources i'm going to reiterate briefly some things i've heard the survey survey employee marlon cook used to be in charge of the water resources branch of the geologic survey.
13345468004: yeah and he he conjectures that the demand for groundwater resources in our state.
13345468004: is going to be paramount.
13345468004: Maybe by mid century.
13345468004: Part of this he part of this is that there may be a shift in terms of agricultural production from the Western us to the southeastern us.
13345468004: you're seeing depletion in major water producing aquifers, the plans major growing areas and so here in the southeast particularly Alabama we actually have, or rather.
13345468004: abundance of groundwater and so will that shift in agriculture, put a demand on our groundwater resources he additionally pointed out that there is.
13345468004: Rapid urbanization going on in our state, particularly in the north central region.
13345468004: And it's conjectured that by by 2015 you will not see a blade of grass from the Mississippi state line to the Georgia line and, of course, so all this, all this growth is going to put them large demand on water resources, especially groundwater, so I think it would be it's particularly.
13345468004: pertinent.
13345468004: To have more hydrogeologist and I would say more licensed geologists specializing in groundwater, this is from a study.
13345468004: I did back in 2017 when I was on the Alabama board.
13345468004: I was just kind of curious about the demographic makeup of the license community, so I.
13345468004: garnered a snapshot and I think that.
13345468004: This sample represents close to 60% of the license population at that time, excuse me.
13345468004: And you'll notice that about a third of the license community are at an age where they are poised to make he grows from the job market.
13345468004: And what you're going to notice is that we don't have that my many new licensees coming down the chute.
13345468004: You know, and so you know I conjecture that there's going to be a tremendous step is set of licensed professionals to meet the geoscience me in our state particularly hydrogeologist and I will.
13345468004: Stop there just just thought I would share that.
13345468004: My thoughts on licensure.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thanks Jim it was really interesting.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Bring my screen back up again.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Alright, we are set, let me bring my chats up.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: quickly, so I did see that justin had commented that he was made aware of licensure at the University of North Carolina wilmington which is great.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: We ran a mentor program yesterday and quite a few of the students had indicated they'd never heard of it, and so you know sadly this is something in your.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: In schooling and academia you don't always hear about and so that's why it's important that we bring it up here.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: So with this why don't I move on to some of the questions that we have here so each of you talk a little bit about your career path, but let's look at your first job and so think back to the very first job that you got and what.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Do you think helped you get that job what tips.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Can you impart with the students that are here to help them get their first job and why don't I start i'll go down i'll start with Randy I realized the sound in alphabetical order now but that's okay.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: i'll start with Randy and then go to gym and then Eric.
Randy Kath: So, how did I get my first job.
13345468004: well.
Randy Kath: First Job was in golden excuse me.
Randy Kath: gold exploration and I had been working on my dissertation at the sats go to school of mines and technology and my research was funded by homestead mining company, and I was looking at different economic models of how the order form within the homestead deposit.
Randy Kath: And it was a clear path that when I got my doctorate and got out of school, they were going to hire me but they ran into a little glitch my wife went to work for home state, and so they had nepotism roles, and so I ended up working.
13345468004: For gold steak exploration a.
Randy Kath: competitor to home steak.
Randy Kath: But it was really based on networking and knowing people who worked at home stage and working.
Randy Kath: The networking between faculty and industry and the hardest job to get is probably your first job and after you get your first job they come pretty easily.
Randy Kath: But it's really important that you work with your faculty members and you go to meetings like GSA and you network with with industry, the best you can and that's how you get your first job.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thanks so much Randy and Jim what comments, would you like to add, where did you get your first job and how.
13345468004: Well, I did spend a year working for the state of Tennessee and as an environmental specialist working in their groundwater protection Program.
13345468004: I simply made application with a state of Tennessee I got called in for an interview.
13345468004: and honestly it wasn't a very good interview, but for some reason you know the hiring manager decided I I fit the bill and it turned out, he he he had a county where he felt he needed somebody who had more of a knowledge of geology he'd been I think hiring.
13345468004: agronomists for for most of the other counties, but you know, for some reason he felt.
13345468004: A knowledge anybody with a knowledge of geology might be a better better fit for that particular location.
13345468004: And that was just really me going out, and you know permitting uic.
13345468004: percent permits, you know for for various reasons for various commercial interests.
13345468004: That that was pretty much.
13345468004: I will concur with Randy that networking is is probably key to advancing your career and keeping garnering that that first job in fact my.
13345468004: i'm going to make a recommendation to you, students and early career professionals, be more engaged with GSA you know if you're a student or not considered being student representative to a GSA committee or division.
13345468004: You will work closely with other people who who you share an interest with and might be interested in helping you further your career.
13345468004: I was recently contacted by a former student from our geology and society division, you know, simply because you know she needed a reference for an internship she's applying to so.
13345468004: yeah you know I think that's an that's a really great way to.
13345468004: You know, develop relationships with with with other individuals, you know and they they might be able to give you a little bit more direction if you're interested in applying to graduate programs, they could probably help you in that in that regard.
13345468004: So, but yeah you know I think GSA is really a good place to to foster networking.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thanks Jim and you had brought something up which i'll circle back to after we hear from.
13345468004: Eric.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: And you had said it wasn't a very good interview so let's we'll talk about that, just a couple minutes I think that's an.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: important thing to discuss.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Here so.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Eric What about you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: How.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: What was your first job and how did you get it, and any tips, you can offer.
Eric Johnson: My first position I got out of school was with a small environmental consulting and engineering company in the Washington DC area.
Eric Johnson: Now pretty much just found the positions by kind of say scouring the.
Eric Johnson: What was available and what positions were kind of open for companies in the area.
13345468004: And just.
Eric Johnson: kind of went through the normal process of sending them a resume and going through the formal interview process.
Eric Johnson: I think you know they were looking for somebody who was you know fresh out of school who probably graduate school they felt had a good again and knowledge and understanding of geology they me some hydro geology knowledge and understanding.
Eric Johnson: Because I think they were positioned involved doing a fair amount of fieldwork where they were going to have you go out in the field, install soil borings install monitoring.
Eric Johnson: wells who sampling.
Eric Johnson: And things of that nature, so they definitely probably felt they needed somebody a little bit younger to go ahead and do that work rather than maybe a more experienced type person to do that, and I think they also seem to be looking for individuals who, because they felt had.
Eric Johnson: Good right writing skills or something like that, because that is a big part of I think just about any field that you go into in this area, whether it's academia.
13345468004: Consulting working for the.
13345468004: State or something.
Eric Johnson: So I think they they wanted to find somebody they feel had good quote communications.
Eric Johnson: Both written and maybe verbal, so I think those were things that they from what I remember, they seem to kind of inquire about.
Eric Johnson: During the interview process and up you know, it was a good start again I only spent about a year and a half there because company is just wasn't doing that much work in the area that I was doing work in interested in and I eventually moved on, but it.
Eric Johnson: was a good start.
Eric Johnson: Definitely got me some good experience good initial exposure to various aspects of doing environmental geology environmental hundred geology.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Excellent thanks Eric and don't whoops there's a little bit of feedback don't mute yourself just yet, I have a couple other questions for you, so do you do any hiring a w SP do you sit you personally sit on panels.
Eric Johnson: Oh no, I am not the same directly involved in the hiring I do maybe review resumes I do have stuff kind of sent my way, at times, depending upon.
Eric Johnson: The position or the position and where it's located, so I do maybe screen or look at those I have done phone screens and some screening of some candidates, initially, and definitely have interviewed a lot of candidates over the years.
Eric Johnson: But right now, based on my kind of job description and responsibilities, my involvement in are directly involved in the hiring process.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Excellent so.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: let's turn to the question about their the comment that Jim had made about interviewing and those of us who are a little later in our career have everyone's had an interview or one of those.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: uncomfortable situations.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: So what suggestions, would you give to someone to make it a good interview what you know how how should they do that's What suggestions, would you have.
um.
13345468004: I would say, really.
13345468004: You know, understand the position that you're applying for research, the company gets another you know, think about what what's the hiring manager wants in terms of a.
13345468004: Of a higher you know what what what qualifications, can you bring to that that position.
13345468004: That that would be the biggest.
13345468004: thing I can think of, and, of course, you know follow the usual interview protocols.
13345468004: Even if you're doing it virtually I would say, you know, try to present yourself well and.
13345468004: You know, and then maybe rehearsal a little bit you know i'm.
13345468004: inherently a very shy person.
13345468004: And you know you know I get incredibly nervous, you know.
13345468004: Not not not so much anymore, but you know I do.
13345468004: You know, have to engage or interface like say somebody at the administrative level i'm looking at a promotion I.
13345468004: yeah I still you know kind of kind of get butterflies, so I kind of do rehearse and then I you know I actually confer with a colleague, you know we you know i'll pitch things to them and they'll.
13345468004: Give me some feedback and said, well, I wouldn't say that I would say it this way and that seems to work.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Excellent that's really helpful and there's I know a student from this meeting that I talked to a little bit some students are very, very nervous and you know, obviously, presenting your first.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Oral session or poster having to get up in front of a group is always hard, and so I think it's important that students realize that you know, is something that everyone faces not just them, and their situation so thanks for sharing that.
13345468004: and
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Eric What about you do you have any comments for students on ways to have a good interview or leave a good impression in an interview.
Eric Johnson: yeah I.
Eric Johnson: definitely agree with the comments that you made again I think you're presenting yourself in a positive manner, you know.
Eric Johnson: Being able to show that you can speak well, you can interact with people well I think is important.
Eric Johnson: You know in consulting field you're going to be put in situations where you're going to have to meet a lot of different people for clients, maybe regulators from State Agency or ETA, maybe other people from the public, and so.
Eric Johnson: A lot of times companies want to feel that you will do a good job and being able to explain what you're doing who you are at work you're doing why you're doing this stuff, and so I think that's important also a lot of companies are.
Eric Johnson: like this, you know we definitely work more in a team environment, so we definitely like when.
Eric Johnson: People who.
13345468004: feel we feel and act as good.
Eric Johnson: team players and good team Member and stuff like that and work well with other people communicate well with other we necessarily may be looking for somebody who's just going to.
Eric Johnson: go in the office close the door and work there for eight hours a day, and then leave and even the interact with anybody and so.
13345468004: Now, I think we try look for those kind of.
Eric Johnson: qualities in people when they interview again your communication, how they speak how they present themselves how they discuss things like a lot of times when I interview people I may ask them about.
Eric Johnson: Their research or some breath you take on to graduate school and i'm not necessarily so much interested in, although I am somebody.
Eric Johnson: The outcome of the research project, but I want them to explain what they get be able to present stuff very.
Eric Johnson: Clearly, and coherently and you'll be able to present information ideas and thoughts and stuff like that, because again that's going to be a big part of the type of work that you do and you'll do more of that and get more involved in that, as you start progressing.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Excellent what.
13345468004: Is your experience when I interviewed here my hiring manager, you know, and I, you know went through the usual.
13345468004: interview banter but then you know she she did she asked me about my research and i've done a lot of work and southeast Alabama I was very passionate about it, and you know when I conveyed that.
13345468004: You know she said, oh yeah you know she told me this later, she said I want him on my team I want somebody you know I want somebody who gets really engaged like that, because that's our that's our culture.
13345468004: And this little program here in groundwater that I started out an underground storage tanks and.
13345468004: You know it's a.
13345468004: it's a it's a it's it's kind of its own little weird culture.
13345468004: You know, within the groundwater branch and but but they're they're actually surprisingly they act a lot like like scientists and like you want to talk around water with them boy it's it's you know it's almost like being back in.
13345468004: Like the back in a while, not the classroom but maybe maybe on a field trip or a research we're we're interacting with colleagues it's.
13345468004: it's great.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: that's wonderful.
that's great to have.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Randy do you have any comments for students on.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: interviewing tips.
Randy Kath: Well, I think, Jim and Eric have covered a lot of it, but what I always tell my students is it's just like preparing for an exam you need to.
Randy Kath: study and learn the company that you're going to interview with know what type of work they do, how your specialties can be integrated into that.
Randy Kath: teamwork very important as Eric pointed out and go into then be competent and if you've you've done your homework and understand the company that you're working with.
Randy Kath: Then you won't you shouldn't get caught off guard and I remember one of my first interviews with golder associates, where I used to work I think wns T just bought golder.
Eric Johnson: Can we did yeah.
Randy Kath: And I remember going in and a PhD and you know everything about.
Randy Kath: thermodynamics and micro probes, and all this and engineering companies don't care you go and you tell them this rock is neoproterozoic and they're like great once you actually impressive strength that's what we want to know, so if you if you.
13345468004: know.
Randy Kath: The company and go in.
Randy Kath: And you can discuss how to your skills could be integrated into their different projects and don't be afraid to say, you know I don't know the answer to that, but i'm will i'll go look it up and see if I can get you an answer.
Randy Kath: So that those that's the advice I would give give the students.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: And that's a great tip to Randy for when you're presenting as well, and you have a question and someone says, well, did you look at whatever if you're not really sure as Randy said you say you know I don't know but that's a great point so that's perfect.
13345468004: and
13345468004: And I love that.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: If you look at our mentors on the screen, you see, we have one from.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: One, who is in academia one who's in government and one who is in industry so.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: let's just sort of hear some positives and negatives about those different sectors so Randy you just spoke a second ago i'll start at the top and work my way down so i'll ask you first Randy so.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Do you enjoy academia and what would you say, are some of the positives and negatives of your job.
Randy Kath: Well i'll give you just a very quick background I started off in industry and gold mining worked for golden associates doing international consulting for about five years.
Randy Kath: And then went into teaching after that, as a government position when I left golder I started my own company which I continued to do external consulting in geology so so I kind of hit all the spectrums but.
Randy Kath: Let me just talk about working for state or federal government's.
Randy Kath: If you go into work and consulting you probably will not control your own destiny you'll be traveling a lot it's not a good position to start a family with.
Randy Kath: A government is great typically if you're working for a state or federal government you don't travel that much you're going to be and don't take this the wrong way and eight to five or you know you go in at eight you're.
Randy Kath: going to be leaving the at five in the afternoon.
Randy Kath: For the most part, of course, you're going to do whatever it takes to get the job done.
Randy Kath: But that's that's really nice because you're not traveling you can start a family, but also you won't get paid as much when I left consulting.
Randy Kath: It took me 15 years teaching to get back to my consultants hours so you're not going to make a lot of money when you were I think Eric can tell you, and consulting you'll make a lot more money, but for me.
Randy Kath: I made a decision when I left consulting that I wanted to control my own destiny and be able to you know impact, students and.
Randy Kath: So that was the reason I went into you know state government basically into teaching.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Excellent thanks so much Randy and Jim do you have any comments to add about working in government or.
or any other comments.
13345468004: yeah it is pretty much a nine to five job there are times, of course, when.
13345468004: you're required to give a little bit more.
13345468004: I do actually travel online.
13345468004: covert sort of shut that down but i'm usually.
13345468004: Working on a lot of projects and doing field work, maybe three days a week, sometimes, for you know I.
13345468004: But that that was just the nature of the programs that I that i'm solicited to.
13345468004: Look at that i'll back up back away from that i'm actually going to convert the beta testing.
13345468004: Our departments new platform so that's that's consumed, a lot of my time so i'm actually.
13345468004: In the office way more than I normally would be.
13345468004: The cons I guess you know the pay, you know it isn't you know you'll you'll do much better on private.
13345468004: You you also don't really have as much latitude in your.
13345468004: Your duties right, you know it's basically you your your work for a program you know these are the requirements, and this is what you're expected to do.
13345468004: The there are there are pluses I mean you know you are.
13345468004: You know, doing i'm making a benefit to the public.
13345468004: Which which I, you know, on occasion, I look back and I think oh wow I did all that, and you know these these people benefit it I think that's great.
13345468004: I will add I couldn't have done that, without the hard work that are members of the private sector, you know the the environmental contract is to go out there and actually.
13345468004: bring these answers to resolve situations and bring successful outcomes to a lot of our.
13345468004: Environmental problems and that's a great segue for Eric.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: perfect.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: So what would you like to add Eric you.
13345468004: know, I think.
Eric Johnson: Randy did a very good job, putting I think the perspective, some of the differences between working in private sector versus maybe government or vimeo and he is right, you know as when I first started out.
Eric Johnson: In consulting you know you do spend a lot of time on the road that's that's kind of understood that's what we tell the.
Eric Johnson: People who come in at an entry level that you will be spending a fair amount of time in the field, but with time, and as you start to.
Eric Johnson: stay with the company and work your way up to the company that amount of time in the field and out of the Office should work does gradually decrease, because some of your.
Eric Johnson: new responsibilities and new roles involves more managing and tracking and doing things of that nature, so you will tend to start to shift from maybe spending.
Eric Johnson: 60 70% of your time in the field, your first few years to maybe 50% adopter me five seven years and then be 30% or 40%, and so it does you see a shift going on and there's reasons for that to your job responsibilities.
Eric Johnson: Our clients don't like to pay people who make a lot of money to go out in the field to do stuff when they can meet you have somebody who's.
Eric Johnson: A little bit younger justice competent just a skill go out and do the work and so there's a lot of things that kind of factor into that may be shipped let's say in feel out of office for versus work.
Eric Johnson: You know some of the so that's one thing you know, is working, the private sector again can take a lot of times of days and weeks, can be long up you know we're.
Eric Johnson: We are usually driven by deadlines that are imposed on get work done so we can't wait and say oh we're going to need another month or something like that it's something.
Eric Johnson: that's probably not going to apply to well with us who were doing the work for or we have to meet so many document or results or before so.
Eric Johnson: yeah our business is more deadline kind of driven to be, but it can be very exciting i've done work all over the place i've been working in Alaska I work out of West Coast work in New England southeast and just all over the place and.
Eric Johnson: Just by the nature of our company I, so I had had an opportunity to get involved in a lot of different projects and a lot of different areas, and a lot of different.
Eric Johnson: theological settings during conditions which can be quite interesting and I think I really enjoyed that I get definitely gives you a.
Eric Johnson: chance to see a lot of different things and experience a lot of things and we've even had people you know go over to Europe and Australia to do work, so if you don't mind traveling post coven somewhere else you know that's a good opportunity.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: i'm Australia, maybe i'll apply.
13345468004: So.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: We do have some students with us and students i'd love.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: This is all it's a very low key relaxed session we want to answer your questions everyone's volunteered their time to help you so if you have questions, please throw those in the chat also.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: If you could let us know, maybe what where you are in your career, are you an undergrad or Grad students, what type of employment are you interested in, so that we can cater our questions to help you a little bit better.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: So while students are commenting let's look at the last question i've got on the screen, which is how does your geoscience education or degree relate to the position that you have now.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: And so i'll start with you Eric and then work my way up so do you feel that what you learned in school is extremely relevant to everything you do now.
Eric Johnson: I would say, overall, probably no.
13345468004: No, I think.
Eric Johnson: A lot of the skills and things that.
Eric Johnson: You would be doing in the consulting field.
Eric Johnson: or environmental consulting i'll be also maybe water resources to you're going to probably learn on the job.
Eric Johnson: Working with other geologists hydrogeologist engineers chemists geochemists and stuff like that I think what school did provides just a very good knowledge base, you know provide some very good basic knowledge on.
Eric Johnson: K griffey sediment apology structural geology rock type ology things of that nature, and those are important because those definitely come in use are very useful when doing fieldwork.
Eric Johnson: and doing certain types of investigations with certain types of activities but there's also going to be an this.
Eric Johnson: Tension weights, the applied aspects.
Eric Johnson: Of the Hydra geology.
Eric Johnson: mentor program here.
Eric Johnson: Now there's going to be a lot of other information and skills that you're going to learn on the job.
Eric Johnson: And so I would say, probably if you had to maybe put a proportion to it, I would say, probably a maybe a third of kind of what I do where I am now is based on my education and probably other two thirds was stuff that I learned later on, as I was in the profession.
Eric Johnson: interesting.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: I do run a career workshop for our students and one of the things that.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: When they did a survey of you know 40 plus geoscience employers, most of them said, you know you don't need to know everything coming in, will train you on the job and it sounds like that's exactly what you were saying as well.
Eric Johnson: yeah that's because this there's some things that when I was going to school, like, I did not have the opportunity to go ahead and oversee the drilling a well borehole and installing them well.
Eric Johnson: and doing certain types of sampling groundwater sample doing awkward for tests things that that I just didn't have opportunities to do that, and that was stuff that I learned.
Eric Johnson: In my professional career working with other more experienced geologists hydrogeologist to essentially taught me how to do those types of activities and that type of work.
Eric Johnson: In addition to maybe hoping to short course or maybe using other I guess ways of increasing your knowledge base and skills and stuff like that so it's a little bit of a mix and also attending meetings like GSA and other stuff like that that definitely helped so it's kind of a mix.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Great Thank you very much, I appreciate that so Jim What about you how much has your.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: educational background helped you in the job that you currently have.
13345468004: I have to concur with Eric about third you know I just came out and knowing the fundamentals.
13345468004: And geoscience and then you know, the state of Alabama said okay here's what you really need to know, and they would send me and my colleagues to various workshops short courses and and even in house training, you know to learn regulations learn all the regulatory.
13345468004: aspects of the job because that was the most important and then.
13345468004: You would get a smattering of.
13345468004: Training from EPA Department of Energy on say.
13345468004: sampling protocols.
13345468004: We did you know.
13345468004: I took you know they will tell you know if you if you came into our program and you would never studied hydro geology.
13345468004: You know the a damn will send you to a couple of special classes on on groundwater they're they're basically to respond.
13345468004: Courses I think one's called the princeton course and I can't remember what the other one was but yeah cars biology and you know you'll you'll learn the rudiments of that there but they but.
13345468004: It where I work it's just mostly you know you know learn the regs learn the nature of.
13345468004: Your record circle BP familiar with those requirements.
13345468004: And then you know I never really did any.
13345468004: The geology that I learned as an undergraduate it's way different from a.
13345468004: Probably less science more science policy related things and then.
13345468004: Eventually, as I progress in my career, I got saddled with rewriting.
13345468004: got into manuals and technical manuals things like that.
13345468004: But yeah you know.
13345468004: You know it's like you know state government here it's probably a lot like private will teach you what we need to learn and and.
13345468004: You know.
13345468004: You know if you know if you if you, you know, if you like, that great.
13345468004: That being said, I do go out on my own and keep up with my own continuing, as you know, in geosciences.
13345468004: Coming up meetings like this, give me a little more latitude I can sit in on sessions workshops things that are more mature man my interests.
13345468004: always be learning that's my that's my that's one.
Recommendation I can make.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: that's a great tip Jim Thank you, what about you Randy.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Have you been using everything you've learned.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: In academia, I would think more so, but.
13345468004: yeah definitely more.
Randy Kath: So it is interesting because you know as as Jim and Eric have said is your academic education is really your foundation and you're going to get out you're going to learn things based on that foundation, so you really want that foundation to be an inch deep and a mile wide.
Randy Kath: Many companies consulting companies to think if you have a PhD or to specialized and I ended up with a Masters and PhD and quantitative metamorphic metrology, which is very specialized.
Randy Kath: But immediately when I started working assertive do instructional geology and mapping and understanding or bodies and our systems, so you learn that.
Randy Kath: But to take structural geology as an undergrad and get all that, and then I going into consulting you know just having that foundation, even though i'd never did engineering geology.
Randy Kath: I taught myself soil mechanics.
Randy Kath: and mechanics and started doing kinematic analysis of rock slopes for highway cuts and so you just learn it on the job, and you just as long as you're willing to.
Randy Kath: keep an open mind and put some extra effort outside of your job at home and on the weekends and build up your skill set.
Randy Kath: For each one of your projects, well then, I went to work at the university after working in gold exploration and consulting.
Randy Kath: And my backgrounds and metamorphic metrology and why don't teach metamorphic geology I teach structural geology engineering geology and economic geology which is really from my days working at homestay can golder.
Randy Kath: So I built up that foundation and that's what got me the position at the university was the structure and economic portion of it, so do good and get that Foundation and the rest of it you'll learn on the job.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Excellent Thank you and we are a small group i'll just say again, students, if you want to ask a question, you can unmute yourself, you can type it in the chat you're welcome to do that.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: But why don't we go ahead i'll move to our last question, which is one I always like to end on, so what hard career lessons have you learned that if you could go back and start over you would do differently and i'll start with Randy I see staring up at the ceiling.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: And then i'll work my way down to.
Eric.
Randy Kath: Well Jennifer i'm going to say I don't think I have a really hard lesson that I would I would do differently.
Randy Kath: i've been with my career path.
Randy Kath: it's been very varied and having a when I left consulting and went into teaching I thought, if I taught the same thing every semester for 20 years i'd get stale.
Randy Kath: I keep changing my classes keep doing consulting on the side so i'm pretty happy with the decisions that i've made I don't think i'd go back and change anything.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Like I fall and do you know that's the first time i've heard that answer that's really great to hear that's wonderful.
13345468004: What about you, Jim any hard.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Lessons that you would do differently if you could look back you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: talk to your former young.
Self.
13345468004: But I tell my young so who.
13345468004: Start networking more more aggressively.
13345468004: I I really didn't develop a network until maybe a decade ago.
13345468004: If I had started earlier, you know I think I would have I would have benefited from that maybe.
13345468004: You know, maybe as soon as I graduated from from college.
13345468004: That that would be something I would pass on to.
13345468004: To the.
13345468004: Any anybody who's an early career professional it does make a difference, your references, you know, the more you can get the better off you'll be.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: that's helpful every major job i've ever had has all been through networking it's really made a really big difference to my career so i'll second that myself.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: What about you Eric if you could you know any hard lessons that you've learned or advice you'd give to yourself, when you were just starting out if you could.
Eric Johnson: Definitely third the the networking recommendation that Jim and you had again I think that's very, very important, and whether you do that in person, using something like linkedin or whatever notes on whatever platform, the truth.
Eric Johnson: is very, very helpful and very rich.
Eric Johnson: or the other thing I would say is keep an open mind.
Eric Johnson: With things, and you know if you see opportunities to do, maybe different things considered it not saying you have to dive into it, but definitely I think you will look to see because the environmental field as your gym and Raven mentioned it covers a lot of areas there's a lot to it.
13345468004: And there you might have opportunities to.
Eric Johnson: Do different things.
Eric Johnson: Whether it's your maybe as an internship when you're still in school or maybe afterwards and you start to get out in your professional career, you may want to work on something.
Eric Johnson: For that, but then.
Eric Johnson: You may want to start to do some work, maybe, if you want to stay in the private sector doing more water resources related work so see an opportunity there may be fine you're still young.
Eric Johnson: Because I think you get to maybe see a lot of different areas where you might be able to use your skills.
Eric Johnson: geological skills and knowledge and then maybe started to focus in on something that you really love that you really, really like I really liked the way around water response, I really like doing modeling around water models that are related offenses and then maybe try to adjust your.
Eric Johnson: Your career professions.
Eric Johnson: To those areas that are area that you really like I just pretty much stay doing the same thing about my professional career and I wish, maybe, looking back and maybe seek out maybe doing some other things, when I was young.
Eric Johnson: Rather than just kind of staying doing environmental.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Excellent Thank you.
13345468004: yeah.
Please do.
13345468004: um yeah I concur with Eric.
13345468004: You know gosh over a decade ago, I want to learn to write policy.
13345468004: But there were no opportunities here, where I work, so I joined a committee at GSA and spent three years working on things like decision statements and White Papers and.
13345468004: yeah I went in there, knowing absolutely nothing, and when I was done, I came out.
13345468004: With a whole different skill set in terms of editing and writing and being able to communicate.
13345468004: highly technical issues to a to the light public and.
13345468004: I really benefited from that and I actually found a new interest you know and that's something that I get to pursue a little bit here and a mom, but if you have opportunities like that thanks that maybe you're even mildly interested in I said go ahead and.
13345468004: Try and try and pursue it it'll you know it'll probably help you grow as a professional.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: that's a great tip I like that a lot any other parting words that any of you would like to offer Randy jammer Eric.
Randy Kath: Jennifer I just put in the chat that.
Randy Kath: If if any of the students have any questions or need information about licensure or wanting to discuss anything that we talked about today feel free to call me that there's my university phone number and my email so i'd be more than happy to talk to you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Wonderful Thank you and for all the students remember as you've heard here multiple times networking is a really important part of your career and so you've had a chance to meet these individuals so make sure you grab their contact info and if you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: have questions certainly follow.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Up later.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Any other.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: comments or questions from our students.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: or Jim you're welcome to comment as well, I apologize.
13345468004: Oh.
13345468004: yeah, you have my my email contact on feel free to drop me a line and i'll be happy to.
13345468004: offer you whatever whatever advice I have.
13345468004: And I will make one recommendation of perseverance, I think, is is kind of the key.
13345468004: To getting a job as well you know if.
13345468004: You know, it can take a while, particularly and.
13345468004: recessionary times, but if you keep plugging away, you know eventually you'll land that first job and from there, you know you'll you'll move forward.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Excellent Thank you very much, well we're a small group so in the session start again in 15 minutes, so this is a nice chance for you to have a few minutes to grab some water before you get going again.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thank you very much Randy and.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: I you just popped in to see how we were doing and I grabbed you and you hung out, and I really appreciate that and Jim and Eric Thank you so much for volunteering your time.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: We really appreciate it very much.
I hope you have a wonderful.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thank you so much, everyone Thank you have a great day and a.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Good rest of the meeting.
Eric Johnson: Thank you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: bye. RISE Jennifer Nocerino: bye. WEBVTT
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: i'll how about I wonder if we should just go ahead and get going.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: And I have a feeling that with cj working with Jim we should have this resolved in no time, so why don't we go ahead and get started, and that way.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: We can keep working on resolving everything in the background, so, first of all, I just want to welcome everyone to the john man mentors and applied hydro geology Program.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: And, as I said, we're still just.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: resolving a couple of technical issues, but I think we will be there and no time.
13345468004: So, Robert can you hear me, yes, I can.
13345468004: yay i'm so glad it worked out, thank you.
13345468004: Thank you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Alright, so Oh, and the other thing Jim you might turn off your sound on your computer screen otherwise you'll get a feedback when you have both your phone and the computer screen not muted.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: So, once again, let me just welcome us to the john man mentors program and I do want to mention that this is a GSA events, and we are using our rise code of conduct so we're i'm asking you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: To be respectful inclusive.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: And to act.
responsibly.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: And with that i'd like to turn it over to vicki mcconnell, which is our GSA executive director for a couple of quick introductions.
Vicki McConnell: hi everyone on.
Vicki McConnell: It.
Vicki McConnell: In so my.
Vicki McConnell: My first part of this is just.
Vicki McConnell: To.
Vicki McConnell: say a bunch of thank yous I want to thank Jennifer know serena for be.
Vicki McConnell: Being the program manager for.
Vicki McConnell: The for these mentor meetings and lunches and everything she.
Vicki McConnell: Does a really great job, and so I sometimes neglect to give a shout out to you Jennifer.
Vicki McConnell: But thank you and she is a big part of this because she finds all of these.
13345468004: awesome mentors.
Vicki McConnell: For you, the students to have an opportunity to.
Vicki McConnell: to interact with.
Vicki McConnell: On.
Vicki McConnell: And so.
Vicki McConnell: that's my second Thank you is to thank all the mentors for taking some time out of their meeting and out of the day.
Vicki McConnell: To do.
Vicki McConnell: To meet with.
Vicki McConnell: Students that are interested in on GEO hydrology and applied.
Vicki McConnell: geology activities and careers it's it's a it's a great direction it's it's the direction I went in my career so not the duck the geo not the hydro part, but the applied part I think it's really, really keen and really important.
Vicki McConnell: On and then the last part that i'll just mention is, these are the kind of programs it in and debbie Martin calcio bring this up a little bit too, but these are the kinds of programs that professional societies do for their their members it's really important.
Vicki McConnell: We see our mission as both.
13345468004: Disseminating.
Vicki McConnell: The science of geoscience in a way that it that it's useful and again can be both.
Vicki McConnell: Research and employment, but we also see the real importance of building careers through the through your whole career she started as a student.
Vicki McConnell: and work your way up through a you're going to have a lot of decision points and there's going to be a lot of times when being in a professional society.
Vicki McConnell: gives you.
Vicki McConnell: Networking capability ability to publish it gives you all kinds of ways that you can work with with developing your career, so please take advantage of that.
Vicki McConnell: i'd love to see you stay as GSA members that's really super some of you may go off and other very specific directions and you find another professional society, so you can join them too, but stick with GSA is what else.
Vicki McConnell: So just thanks everyone I don't want to take up any more your time because we're running a little late already do take advantage students of talking with these mentors asking the hard questions that's what they're here for Thank you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thanks so much vicki I appreciate it and debbie What would you like, let me introduce you i'm sorry.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: This is debbie marston cascade she's with GSA foundation which takes care of the funds for all of these programs.
Debora Marcinkowski: hi everyone nice to see all of you so on behalf of the Foundation, I just want to welcome all of you, and let you know that we are the arm that helps fund programs like this and others for students, if we were in person, I would invite you to come to our GSA foundation.
Debora Marcinkowski: booth because we are a.
Debora Marcinkowski: lot of information about other programs for students, like our graduate student research grants on to the future.
Debora Marcinkowski: Some expanding representation in the geoscience scholarship so lots of things to tell you about, and if you have any questions about other student programs, you can always ask Jennifer or.
Debora Marcinkowski: My way but Jennifer would be your first to go to there so programs like this are funded by really generous donors to the GSA foundation and Dr john man was a longtime Member.
Debora Marcinkowski: Obviously, a hydrogeologist himself in the applied sector and Members like him have been really committed to encouraging students to pursue careers in the geosciences and so see fit to contribute significantly for programs like this to go on in perpetuity.
Debora Marcinkowski: So that's how these programs.
Debora Marcinkowski: are funded and able to happen for people like Jennifer to carry them out, and so just a reminder to, of course, hopefully you'll maintain your membership with us, and there are a lot of ways that you might also think about contributing yourself.
Debora Marcinkowski: Whether it's coming back as a mentor.
For future programs.
Debora Marcinkowski: Maybe he donating a bit, we have a great student donor group believe it or not, we have almost 1200 GSA student Members who donate it's a group called tectonics.
Debora Marcinkowski: building the future.
Debora Marcinkowski: We have a fun little gift for any student donors and it requires a very small contribution to be a part of that So hopefully we'll see you all again thanks guys.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thanks so much debbie I appreciate that.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Alright, so i'd like to now move on to our mentors and Edwin Andrews is not with us today, but Randy kath actually hopped in, and so I think I will ask him to introduce himself as well, so Jim would you like to start.
13345468004: Oh sure.
13345468004: Welcome to my very messy Office, my name is TIM Keller i'm amanda geosciences staff in the groundwater branch of the Alabama department of environmental management and i'm happy to say, I recently completed my 25th and them here never thought I would be here this one.
13345468004: fun fact and i'll digress briefly, I never thought I would ever ever.
13345468004: Do hydrogeologist, in fact, if you had asked me at the start of my career, would I consider hydrogeologist a vocation, I would have said no Absolutely not.
13345468004: And that being kept being said, you know I just I had a terrible experience as an undergraduate by taking a hydro geology course and they just totally turn me off on the subject, you know my passion is really.
13345468004: paleontology and I pursued that, but when I finished my graduate degree.
13345468004: I graduated into a recession and I didn't have a lot of flexibility, and in my career choices, so I ended up at the Alabama department of environmental management, they were the only.
13345468004: place that was really hiring and I was living in the southeast, and so I packed up my suitcase and moved to Montgomery.
13345468004: A little bit about my education, I did my undergraduate at rockers college records university and then I worked a little bit in industry and then I ended up pursuing a master's degree at the University of Tennessee and uh and then the rest is history 25 years later, here I am.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: sorry about that I was typing in the chat I apologize.
13345468004: So.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thank you very much, Jim I appreciate that and Eric Johnson, would you like to introduce yourself.
Eric Johnson: well.
Eric Johnson: My name is Eric Johnson, I have a slightly somewhat important title, although.
Eric Johnson: I do a director geology for company called ws P USA, where a consulting and engineering company with offices in the US and overseas.
Eric Johnson: My.
Eric Johnson: I guess career path at least starting off.
Eric Johnson: Is sounds very similar to gyms and that I went to graduate school at rutgers college in new brunswick and graduated there and then.
Eric Johnson: I went to graduate school right after that the University of Tennessee knoxville.
Eric Johnson: And graduated from there.
Eric Johnson: Give the date but it's a little while ago and.
Eric Johnson: When I like maybe Jim was experiencing when I was completing my graduate education, the job market somewhat was.
13345468004: A little lean for geologists.
Eric Johnson: And when I was finishing up I had an opportunity with my advisor.
Eric Johnson: To be able to do a little bit of what you might call from.
13345468004: Consulting work jonjo consulting.
Eric Johnson: work which pretty much just involved geologic.
13345468004: mapping.
Eric Johnson: And some errors in East Tennessee.
13345468004: And from there, I.
Eric Johnson: was able to get a job.
Eric Johnson: With a small kind of company that did a mix of environmental consulting and some other engineering work up in the Washington DC area and from there went to work shortly after joining that company, about a year later, with a bigger company.
Eric Johnson: That just had a lot more.
13345468004: Opportunities for.
Eric Johnson: Doing geologic geological work both in the eastern us pretty much all over, and so I moved to that company and that's kind of who i've stayed with for the last.
Eric Johnson: 30 plus years and just kind of worked my way up the quote unquote ladder, so to speak up in the environmental consulting our company's been under various different names.
13345468004: In this industry is such that.
Eric Johnson: Companies get bought join forces more with time and so.
13345468004: company was when I first started out probably six or seven.
Eric Johnson: For the company, since I joined up and very my I guess career, I just started out doing technical work, a lot of field or.
Eric Johnson: sample collection of data evaluation and analysis and as we started to work my way up and through the company started to get more into that's a task management involved in.
13345468004: Really, yes I guess.
Eric Johnson: Major activities.
Eric Johnson: Planning scoping executing completing and then eventually what I do now is more kind of have like a project management that's a role with also providing some technical support for other projects and other things going on with the company so.
Eric Johnson: that's pretty much my.
Eric Johnson: background, in a nutshell.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Wonderful thanks so much Eric I appreciate that and Randy CAP is with us and Randy would you like to introduce yourself.
Randy Kath: Sure i'll give you a brief introduction Randy cat a professor in geology of the University of West Georgia.
Randy Kath: Prior to teaching at the university I worked in gold exploration for about eight and a half years, and the Western United States since coming to the university I have now been there, as my 26 year it's hard to believe.
Randy Kath: And I also am the academic coordinator for as Bob and for many of the students you'll understand licensure many of our States require licensure.
Randy Kath: And i've been working with as bug since 2007 also sit on the Georgia board for professional genealogists if you come to Georgia and get licensed i'll probably be reviewing your license application.
Randy Kath: So if you have any questions about licensure and certification in different states, be happy to answer any of those questions for you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thanks so much Randy I appreciate that, so our program is run entirely by student questions, we do have a few students in here we've done some introductions So if you have questions go ahead and type those in.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: I would like to spend just a moment talking about certification so i'm going to put Randy and Jim on the spot very quickly.
13345468004: And a lot of.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Students are not familiar with certification to.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: become a professional genealogist and for the students who are with us, will you type into the chat box, if you are familiar with certification or not just so that we know.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: But it is really important for you to become aware of, and I try to spend a little bit of time talking about it, and all of our mentor programs.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: So Randy do you mind saying a couple words about certification and why it's important and then perhaps Jim you could say a word or two after Randy.
Randy Kath: Sure Jennifer can I share my screen is that.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Sure, let me see if I can i'll do a stop share on me.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Okay, then you should see a share screen green button at the.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: bottom, it should be a green button that says share screen.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: yeah awesome.
Randy Kath: yeah so Jim and I have worked.
Randy Kath: Before at.
Randy Kath: Some of these mentoring luncheons for.
Randy Kath: GSA tag team these before if you want to work in one of these green states these states have licensed your laws and it's in the Statute and if.
Randy Kath: You.
Randy Kath: Have public practice.
Randy Kath: Of geology in any of these green states, you have to have a life.
Randy Kath: Many of the States exempt state and federal workers.
Randy Kath: But that's starting to go away to the usgs is starting to require certification and corps of engineers is starting to require certification.
Randy Kath: Of the States that are in blue Michigan and iowa they do not have state license your laws, but they do allow you to take fundamentals of geology examination.
Randy Kath: So your path to licensure is first you'll need to get a degree in geology or geological engineering or geosciences or something.
Randy Kath: of that nature and then you take the first examination that's required by the States and green and that's called the fundamentals of geology exam and the fundamentals of geology exam is very.
Randy Kath: comprehensive examination, it will cover pretty much everything you did as an undergraduate in geology.
Randy Kath: So I highly recommend that you take that examination as soon as you get out of school.
Randy Kath: You don't want to get down the road 1015 years and then have to come back into the fundamentals because you've probably forgotten, a lot of those fundamentals as you've started to be more of a practitioner and get more specialized in what you do.
Randy Kath: Once you get experience after you pass the fundamentals of geology exam many States require anywhere from four to seven years work experience under a P professional engineer or professional geologists.
Randy Kath: And then you come back and you take a second examination, which is called the practice of geology examination and when you pass that examination most states will give you a license.
Randy Kath: And one one of the big advantages of licensure of all these green states is you have mobility of your license.
Randy Kath: So, for instance, if I was an undergraduate and I took the fundamentals of geology in Georgia, where i'm at.
Randy Kath: And I ended up moving out to Oregon I can take the practice of geology exam in Oregon and become licensed in Oregon and then, if I want to move to maine and get a license there.
Randy Kath: All I do is apply to the main board and they see that i'm already have a license by examination and experience in the main board.
Randy Kath: Of course, will make you pay some dollars and then you'll be licensed in maine and then 10 years down the road, I might want to move to Texas and Texas will recognize that as bug license as well, so it's a really advantageous for you to.
Randy Kath: take the first step to licensure and take fundamentals, the geology examination as soon as you can when you get out of school.
Randy Kath: And then that after you get your work experience take that second examination.
Randy Kath: Now i'm university professor and i'm exempt I don't have to be licensed but i'm licensed in four states, because I do the public practice of geology, so I do consulting work and other work.
Randy Kath: Outside the university and I really think it's important for your careers to start your path to license your by taking that first examination.
Randy Kath: Okay i'll give it back to you Jennifer.
13345468004: Others to share screen work.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: So down at the bottom, you have our.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: could be at the top it'll be.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: A green share screen button.
13345468004: Right.
13345468004: yeah we didn't show up on your monitor.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Would you like to share.
13345468004: With Microsoft came here.
13345468004: No problem.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: i'll stop the share of my screen and then Jim you should be able to see a green share screen.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: button across the bottom or the top where you have your control panel.
13345468004: Okay, what do I do now, I get a window that.
13345468004: yeah so you click the one you want to share and then you click the.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Share button after that.
13345468004: yeah let's try that and while.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: he's bringing that up I did put in some information for the students or anyone who wants to attend GSA will be doing.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: A webinar on certification we actually have someone who recently got.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: The GI T and someone who recently got a PG and so they're there to answer questions and and help folks.
13345468004: and
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: I promise we'll get back to you soon Eric I apologize you're welcome to add a.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: few moments, or a few comments about certification if you'd like as well, please.
Eric Johnson: I can do that, first of all, I could definitely second randy's recommendation as far as taking the fundamentals of geology exam as soon as you get out of school because I was in that group or did not take the exam until about 10 to 15 years.
13345468004: afterwards.
Eric Johnson: and, believe me, I had to spend a lot of time.
Eric Johnson: Going back and reviewing relearning things like mineralogy metrology structural geology best.
13345468004: Areas that.
Eric Johnson: In my professional career, I wasn't really using that much, and so I and like clarity mentioned it's a very comprehensive exam on demand, and so you really need to know a lot of that information.
Eric Johnson: To be able to do well in that exam also kind of a plug for GSA a lot of states have what they call continuing education require.
Eric Johnson: And so on a lot of those involved, maybe participation in conferences or meetings like as a separate from each.
Eric Johnson: Other you know, maybe webinars or any other I guess vehicle or or event that that essentially helps you grow your knowledge base where all your understanding heidrick theology geologic principles to chemistry things of that nature.
Eric Johnson: Because some States don't have it, but a lot of them do I think some states.
13345468004: Are.
Eric Johnson: are starting to go to that a little bit.
Eric Johnson: More, and so I think students staying involved in organizations like GSA and other ones like that is a really good idea because it will just help you be able to fulfill those continuing education requirements when you eventually get your PG.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thank you very much, I appreciate that and Jim, we can see your screen so feel free.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: To add some.
comments.
13345468004: Oh, thanks, if you might remember this from 2019 I I let a Randy and I lead a licensure workshop over in charleston.
13345468004: And I totally concur with Eric I remember having to study for the ass blog has been out of college for probably.
13345468004: Eight years at that point, you know, and it was and when you're working full time it is, it is a real drain.
13345468004: So if you have the opportunity to take that F G as soon as you can like maybe during your senior year or following graduation, please do so, you know do it, while that that information is fresh in your mind.
13345468004: Randy pretty much touched on everything pertinent to ask Bob, I just wanted to say that.
13345468004: yeah licensure is important because, when you're working within the public domain, your clients, or maybe a government agency, you know they're they're expecting you to.
13345468004: produce a product that that you know you can defend the veracity and interpretation of that results and, though, and so, when you apply your professional stamper seal to that document.
13345468004: You know your your ascertaining its its validity.
13345468004: And so licensure I think does a lot to promote responsibility within the profession, as well as accountability.
13345468004: i'll skip this part because you know I think that's pretty.
13345468004: Just just for the second time.
13345468004: But I want to talk a little bit about career opportunities, and so this this comes back this goes back to that 2019.
13345468004: But talk I get i'm sure the the statistics have changed since then, but you know, as you can see your Bureau of Labor statistics does suggest that there is rather robust.
13345468004: job growth in the geoscientist profession, and I would argue hydro geology is really relevant, particularly in those States here in the southeast where you're seeing a burgeoning population growth Tennessee Florida.
13345468004: You know, really, really stellar growth if you're living in the north and you're retiring you know you're migrating down South in Tennessee for the carolinas are popular destinations for that.
13345468004: Alabama is seeing a surge and growth in some municipalities, particularly Huntsville Alabama it's poised to be the largest municipality, and the state this year it will it will eclipse the city of Birmingham.
13345468004: So this expansion and.
13345468004: You know, and some of these cities, you know, requires a lot of.
13345468004: Planning and engineering, particularly for public works and and I would argue, water resources i'm going to reiterate briefly some things i've heard the survey survey employee marlon cook used to be in charge of the water resources branch of the geologic survey.
13345468004: yeah and he he conjectures that the demand for groundwater resources in our state.
13345468004: is going to be paramount.
13345468004: Maybe by mid century.
13345468004: Part of this he part of this is that there may be a shift in terms of agricultural production from the Western us to the southeastern us.
13345468004: you're seeing depletion in major water producing aquifers, the plans major growing areas and so here in the southeast particularly Alabama we actually have, or rather.
13345468004: abundance of groundwater and so will that shift in agriculture, put a demand on our groundwater resources he additionally pointed out that there is.
13345468004: Rapid urbanization going on in our state, particularly in the north central region.
13345468004: And it's conjectured that by by 2015 you will not see a blade of grass from the Mississippi state line to the Georgia line and, of course, so all this, all this growth is going to put them large demand on water resources, especially groundwater, so I think it would be it's particularly.
13345468004: pertinent.
13345468004: To have more hydrogeologist and I would say more licensed geologists specializing in groundwater, this is from a study.
13345468004: I did back in 2017 when I was on the Alabama board.
13345468004: I was just kind of curious about the demographic makeup of the license community, so I.
13345468004: garnered a snapshot and I think that.
13345468004: This sample represents close to 60% of the license population at that time, excuse me.
13345468004: And you'll notice that about a third of the license community are at an age where they are poised to make he grows from the job market.
13345468004: And what you're going to notice is that we don't have that my many new licensees coming down the chute.
13345468004: You know, and so you know I conjecture that there's going to be a tremendous step is set of licensed professionals to meet the geoscience me in our state particularly hydrogeologist and I will.
13345468004: Stop there just just thought I would share that.
13345468004: My thoughts on licensure.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thanks Jim it was really interesting.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Bring my screen back up again.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Alright, we are set, let me bring my chats up.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: quickly, so I did see that justin had commented that he was made aware of licensure at the University of North Carolina wilmington which is great.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: We ran a mentor program yesterday and quite a few of the students had indicated they'd never heard of it, and so you know sadly this is something in your.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: In schooling and academia you don't always hear about and so that's why it's important that we bring it up here.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: So with this why don't I move on to some of the questions that we have here so each of you talk a little bit about your career path, but let's look at your first job and so think back to the very first job that you got and what.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Do you think helped you get that job what tips.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Can you impart with the students that are here to help them get their first job and why don't I start i'll go down i'll start with Randy I realized the sound in alphabetical order now but that's okay.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: i'll start with Randy and then go to gym and then Eric.
Randy Kath: So, how did I get my first job.
13345468004: well.
Randy Kath: First Job was in golden excuse me.
Randy Kath: gold exploration and I had been working on my dissertation at the sats go to school of mines and technology and my research was funded by homestead mining company, and I was looking at different economic models of how the order form within the homestead deposit.
Randy Kath: And it was a clear path that when I got my doctorate and got out of school, they were going to hire me but they ran into a little glitch my wife went to work for home state, and so they had nepotism roles, and so I ended up working.
13345468004: For gold steak exploration a.
Randy Kath: competitor to home steak.
Randy Kath: But it was really based on networking and knowing people who worked at home stage and working.
Randy Kath: The networking between faculty and industry and the hardest job to get is probably your first job and after you get your first job they come pretty easily.
Randy Kath: But it's really important that you work with your faculty members and you go to meetings like GSA and you network with with industry, the best you can and that's how you get your first job.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thanks so much Randy and Jim what comments, would you like to add, where did you get your first job and how.
13345468004: Well, I did spend a year working for the state of Tennessee and as an environmental specialist working in their groundwater protection Program.
13345468004: I simply made application with a state of Tennessee I got called in for an interview.
13345468004: and honestly it wasn't a very good interview, but for some reason you know the hiring manager decided I I fit the bill and it turned out, he he he had a county where he felt he needed somebody who had more of a knowledge of geology he'd been I think hiring.
13345468004: agronomists for for most of the other counties, but you know, for some reason he felt.
13345468004: A knowledge anybody with a knowledge of geology might be a better better fit for that particular location.
13345468004: And that was just really me going out, and you know permitting uic.
13345468004: percent permits, you know for for various reasons for various commercial interests.
13345468004: That that was pretty much.
13345468004: I will concur with Randy that networking is is probably key to advancing your career and keeping garnering that that first job in fact my.
13345468004: i'm going to make a recommendation to you, students and early career professionals, be more engaged with GSA you know if you're a student or not considered being student representative to a GSA committee or division.
13345468004: You will work closely with other people who who you share an interest with and might be interested in helping you further your career.
13345468004: I was recently contacted by a former student from our geology and society division, you know, simply because you know she needed a reference for an internship she's applying to so.
13345468004: yeah you know I think that's an that's a really great way to.
13345468004: You know, develop relationships with with with other individuals, you know and they they might be able to give you a little bit more direction if you're interested in applying to graduate programs, they could probably help you in that in that regard.
13345468004: So, but yeah you know I think GSA is really a good place to to foster networking.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thanks Jim and you had brought something up which i'll circle back to after we hear from.
13345468004: Eric.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: And you had said it wasn't a very good interview so let's we'll talk about that, just a couple minutes I think that's an.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: important thing to discuss.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Here so.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Eric What about you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: How.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: What was your first job and how did you get it, and any tips, you can offer.
Eric Johnson: My first position I got out of school was with a small environmental consulting and engineering company in the Washington DC area.
Eric Johnson: Now pretty much just found the positions by kind of say scouring the.
Eric Johnson: What was available and what positions were kind of open for companies in the area.
13345468004: And just.
Eric Johnson: kind of went through the normal process of sending them a resume and going through the formal interview process.
Eric Johnson: I think you know they were looking for somebody who was you know fresh out of school who probably graduate school they felt had a good again and knowledge and understanding of geology they me some hydro geology knowledge and understanding.
Eric Johnson: Because I think they were positioned involved doing a fair amount of fieldwork where they were going to have you go out in the field, install soil borings install monitoring.
Eric Johnson: wells who sampling.
Eric Johnson: And things of that nature, so they definitely probably felt they needed somebody a little bit younger to go ahead and do that work rather than maybe a more experienced type person to do that, and I think they also seem to be looking for individuals who, because they felt had.
Eric Johnson: Good right writing skills or something like that, because that is a big part of I think just about any field that you go into in this area, whether it's academia.
13345468004: Consulting working for the.
13345468004: State or something.
Eric Johnson: So I think they they wanted to find somebody they feel had good quote communications.
Eric Johnson: Both written and maybe verbal, so I think those were things that they from what I remember, they seem to kind of inquire about.
Eric Johnson: During the interview process and up you know, it was a good start again I only spent about a year and a half there because company is just wasn't doing that much work in the area that I was doing work in interested in and I eventually moved on, but it.
Eric Johnson: was a good start.
Eric Johnson: Definitely got me some good experience good initial exposure to various aspects of doing environmental geology environmental hundred geology.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Excellent thanks Eric and don't whoops there's a little bit of feedback don't mute yourself just yet, I have a couple other questions for you, so do you do any hiring a w SP do you sit you personally sit on panels.
Eric Johnson: Oh no, I am not the same directly involved in the hiring I do maybe review resumes I do have stuff kind of sent my way, at times, depending upon.
Eric Johnson: The position or the position and where it's located, so I do maybe screen or look at those I have done phone screens and some screening of some candidates, initially, and definitely have interviewed a lot of candidates over the years.
Eric Johnson: But right now, based on my kind of job description and responsibilities, my involvement in are directly involved in the hiring process.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Excellent so.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: let's turn to the question about their the comment that Jim had made about interviewing and those of us who are a little later in our career have everyone's had an interview or one of those.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: uncomfortable situations.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: So what suggestions, would you give to someone to make it a good interview what you know how how should they do that's What suggestions, would you have.
um.
13345468004: I would say, really.
13345468004: You know, understand the position that you're applying for research, the company gets another you know, think about what what's the hiring manager wants in terms of a.
13345468004: Of a higher you know what what what qualifications, can you bring to that that position.
13345468004: That that would be the biggest.
13345468004: thing I can think of, and, of course, you know follow the usual interview protocols.
13345468004: Even if you're doing it virtually I would say, you know, try to present yourself well and.
13345468004: You know, and then maybe rehearsal a little bit you know i'm.
13345468004: inherently a very shy person.
13345468004: And you know you know I get incredibly nervous, you know.
13345468004: Not not not so much anymore, but you know I do.
13345468004: You know, have to engage or interface like say somebody at the administrative level i'm looking at a promotion I.
13345468004: yeah I still you know kind of kind of get butterflies, so I kind of do rehearse and then I you know I actually confer with a colleague, you know we you know i'll pitch things to them and they'll.
13345468004: Give me some feedback and said, well, I wouldn't say that I would say it this way and that seems to work.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Excellent that's really helpful and there's I know a student from this meeting that I talked to a little bit some students are very, very nervous and you know, obviously, presenting your first.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Oral session or poster having to get up in front of a group is always hard, and so I think it's important that students realize that you know, is something that everyone faces not just them, and their situation so thanks for sharing that.
13345468004: and
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Eric What about you do you have any comments for students on ways to have a good interview or leave a good impression in an interview.
Eric Johnson: yeah I.
Eric Johnson: definitely agree with the comments that you made again I think you're presenting yourself in a positive manner, you know.
Eric Johnson: Being able to show that you can speak well, you can interact with people well I think is important.
Eric Johnson: You know in consulting field you're going to be put in situations where you're going to have to meet a lot of different people for clients, maybe regulators from State Agency or ETA, maybe other people from the public, and so.
Eric Johnson: A lot of times companies want to feel that you will do a good job and being able to explain what you're doing who you are at work you're doing why you're doing this stuff, and so I think that's important also a lot of companies are.
Eric Johnson: like this, you know we definitely work more in a team environment, so we definitely like when.
Eric Johnson: People who.
13345468004: feel we feel and act as good.
Eric Johnson: team players and good team Member and stuff like that and work well with other people communicate well with other we necessarily may be looking for somebody who's just going to.
Eric Johnson: go in the office close the door and work there for eight hours a day, and then leave and even the interact with anybody and so.
13345468004: Now, I think we try look for those kind of.
Eric Johnson: qualities in people when they interview again your communication, how they speak how they present themselves how they discuss things like a lot of times when I interview people I may ask them about.
Eric Johnson: Their research or some breath you take on to graduate school and i'm not necessarily so much interested in, although I am somebody.
Eric Johnson: The outcome of the research project, but I want them to explain what they get be able to present stuff very.
Eric Johnson: Clearly, and coherently and you'll be able to present information ideas and thoughts and stuff like that, because again that's going to be a big part of the type of work that you do and you'll do more of that and get more involved in that, as you start progressing.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Excellent what.
13345468004: Is your experience when I interviewed here my hiring manager, you know, and I, you know went through the usual.
13345468004: interview banter but then you know she she did she asked me about my research and i've done a lot of work and southeast Alabama I was very passionate about it, and you know when I conveyed that.
13345468004: You know she said, oh yeah you know she told me this later, she said I want him on my team I want somebody you know I want somebody who gets really engaged like that, because that's our that's our culture.
13345468004: And this little program here in groundwater that I started out an underground storage tanks and.
13345468004: You know it's a.
13345468004: it's a it's a it's it's kind of its own little weird culture.
13345468004: You know, within the groundwater branch and but but they're they're actually surprisingly they act a lot like like scientists and like you want to talk around water with them boy it's it's you know it's almost like being back in.
13345468004: Like the back in a while, not the classroom but maybe maybe on a field trip or a research we're we're interacting with colleagues it's.
13345468004: it's great.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: that's wonderful.
that's great to have.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Randy do you have any comments for students on.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: interviewing tips.
Randy Kath: Well, I think, Jim and Eric have covered a lot of it, but what I always tell my students is it's just like preparing for an exam you need to.
Randy Kath: study and learn the company that you're going to interview with know what type of work they do, how your specialties can be integrated into that.
Randy Kath: teamwork very important as Eric pointed out and go into then be competent and if you've you've done your homework and understand the company that you're working with.
Randy Kath: Then you won't you shouldn't get caught off guard and I remember one of my first interviews with golder associates, where I used to work I think wns T just bought golder.
Eric Johnson: Can we did yeah.
Randy Kath: And I remember going in and a PhD and you know everything about.
Randy Kath: thermodynamics and micro probes, and all this and engineering companies don't care you go and you tell them this rock is neoproterozoic and they're like great once you actually impressive strength that's what we want to know, so if you if you.
13345468004: know.
Randy Kath: The company and go in.
Randy Kath: And you can discuss how to your skills could be integrated into their different projects and don't be afraid to say, you know I don't know the answer to that, but i'm will i'll go look it up and see if I can get you an answer.
Randy Kath: So that those that's the advice I would give give the students.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: And that's a great tip to Randy for when you're presenting as well, and you have a question and someone says, well, did you look at whatever if you're not really sure as Randy said you say you know I don't know but that's a great point so that's perfect.
13345468004: and
13345468004: And I love that.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: If you look at our mentors on the screen, you see, we have one from.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: One, who is in academia one who's in government and one who is in industry so.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: let's just sort of hear some positives and negatives about those different sectors so Randy you just spoke a second ago i'll start at the top and work my way down so i'll ask you first Randy so.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Do you enjoy academia and what would you say, are some of the positives and negatives of your job.
Randy Kath: Well i'll give you just a very quick background I started off in industry and gold mining worked for golden associates doing international consulting for about five years.
Randy Kath: And then went into teaching after that, as a government position when I left golder I started my own company which I continued to do external consulting in geology so so I kind of hit all the spectrums but.
Randy Kath: Let me just talk about working for state or federal government's.
Randy Kath: If you go into work and consulting you probably will not control your own destiny you'll be traveling a lot it's not a good position to start a family with.
Randy Kath: A government is great typically if you're working for a state or federal government you don't travel that much you're going to be and don't take this the wrong way and eight to five or you know you go in at eight you're.
Randy Kath: going to be leaving the at five in the afternoon.
Randy Kath: For the most part, of course, you're going to do whatever it takes to get the job done.
Randy Kath: But that's that's really nice because you're not traveling you can start a family, but also you won't get paid as much when I left consulting.
Randy Kath: It took me 15 years teaching to get back to my consultants hours so you're not going to make a lot of money when you were I think Eric can tell you, and consulting you'll make a lot more money, but for me.
Randy Kath: I made a decision when I left consulting that I wanted to control my own destiny and be able to you know impact, students and.
Randy Kath: So that was the reason I went into you know state government basically into teaching.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Excellent thanks so much Randy and Jim do you have any comments to add about working in government or.
or any other comments.
13345468004: yeah it is pretty much a nine to five job there are times, of course, when.
13345468004: you're required to give a little bit more.
13345468004: I do actually travel online.
13345468004: covert sort of shut that down but i'm usually.
13345468004: Working on a lot of projects and doing field work, maybe three days a week, sometimes, for you know I.
13345468004: But that that was just the nature of the programs that I that i'm solicited to.
13345468004: Look at that i'll back up back away from that i'm actually going to convert the beta testing.
13345468004: Our departments new platform so that's that's consumed, a lot of my time so i'm actually.
13345468004: In the office way more than I normally would be.
13345468004: The cons I guess you know the pay, you know it isn't you know you'll you'll do much better on private.
13345468004: You you also don't really have as much latitude in your.
13345468004: Your duties right, you know it's basically you your your work for a program you know these are the requirements, and this is what you're expected to do.
13345468004: The there are there are pluses I mean you know you are.
13345468004: You know, doing i'm making a benefit to the public.
13345468004: Which which I, you know, on occasion, I look back and I think oh wow I did all that, and you know these these people benefit it I think that's great.
13345468004: I will add I couldn't have done that, without the hard work that are members of the private sector, you know the the environmental contract is to go out there and actually.
13345468004: bring these answers to resolve situations and bring successful outcomes to a lot of our.
13345468004: Environmental problems and that's a great segue for Eric.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: perfect.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: So what would you like to add Eric you.
13345468004: know, I think.
Eric Johnson: Randy did a very good job, putting I think the perspective, some of the differences between working in private sector versus maybe government or vimeo and he is right, you know as when I first started out.
Eric Johnson: In consulting you know you do spend a lot of time on the road that's that's kind of understood that's what we tell the.
Eric Johnson: People who come in at an entry level that you will be spending a fair amount of time in the field, but with time, and as you start to.
Eric Johnson: stay with the company and work your way up to the company that amount of time in the field and out of the Office should work does gradually decrease, because some of your.
Eric Johnson: new responsibilities and new roles involves more managing and tracking and doing things of that nature, so you will tend to start to shift from maybe spending.
Eric Johnson: 60 70% of your time in the field, your first few years to maybe 50% adopter me five seven years and then be 30% or 40%, and so it does you see a shift going on and there's reasons for that to your job responsibilities.
Eric Johnson: Our clients don't like to pay people who make a lot of money to go out in the field to do stuff when they can meet you have somebody who's.
Eric Johnson: A little bit younger justice competent just a skill go out and do the work and so there's a lot of things that kind of factor into that may be shipped let's say in feel out of office for versus work.
Eric Johnson: You know some of the so that's one thing you know, is working, the private sector again can take a lot of times of days and weeks, can be long up you know we're.
Eric Johnson: We are usually driven by deadlines that are imposed on get work done so we can't wait and say oh we're going to need another month or something like that it's something.
Eric Johnson: that's probably not going to apply to well with us who were doing the work for or we have to meet so many document or results or before so.
Eric Johnson: yeah our business is more deadline kind of driven to be, but it can be very exciting i've done work all over the place i've been working in Alaska I work out of West Coast work in New England southeast and just all over the place and.
Eric Johnson: Just by the nature of our company I, so I had had an opportunity to get involved in a lot of different projects and a lot of different areas, and a lot of different.
Eric Johnson: theological settings during conditions which can be quite interesting and I think I really enjoyed that I get definitely gives you a.
Eric Johnson: chance to see a lot of different things and experience a lot of things and we've even had people you know go over to Europe and Australia to do work, so if you don't mind traveling post coven somewhere else you know that's a good opportunity.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: i'm Australia, maybe i'll apply.
13345468004: So.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: We do have some students with us and students i'd love.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: This is all it's a very low key relaxed session we want to answer your questions everyone's volunteered their time to help you so if you have questions, please throw those in the chat also.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: If you could let us know, maybe what where you are in your career, are you an undergrad or Grad students, what type of employment are you interested in, so that we can cater our questions to help you a little bit better.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: So while students are commenting let's look at the last question i've got on the screen, which is how does your geoscience education or degree relate to the position that you have now.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: And so i'll start with you Eric and then work my way up so do you feel that what you learned in school is extremely relevant to everything you do now.
Eric Johnson: I would say, overall, probably no.
13345468004: No, I think.
Eric Johnson: A lot of the skills and things that.
Eric Johnson: You would be doing in the consulting field.
Eric Johnson: or environmental consulting i'll be also maybe water resources to you're going to probably learn on the job.
Eric Johnson: Working with other geologists hydrogeologist engineers chemists geochemists and stuff like that I think what school did provides just a very good knowledge base, you know provide some very good basic knowledge on.
Eric Johnson: K griffey sediment apology structural geology rock type ology things of that nature, and those are important because those definitely come in use are very useful when doing fieldwork.
Eric Johnson: and doing certain types of investigations with certain types of activities but there's also going to be an this.
Eric Johnson: Tension weights, the applied aspects.
Eric Johnson: Of the Hydra geology.
Eric Johnson: mentor program here.
Eric Johnson: Now there's going to be a lot of other information and skills that you're going to learn on the job.
Eric Johnson: And so I would say, probably if you had to maybe put a proportion to it, I would say, probably a maybe a third of kind of what I do where I am now is based on my education and probably other two thirds was stuff that I learned later on, as I was in the profession.
Eric Johnson: interesting.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: I do run a career workshop for our students and one of the things that.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: When they did a survey of you know 40 plus geoscience employers, most of them said, you know you don't need to know everything coming in, will train you on the job and it sounds like that's exactly what you were saying as well.
Eric Johnson: yeah that's because this there's some things that when I was going to school, like, I did not have the opportunity to go ahead and oversee the drilling a well borehole and installing them well.
Eric Johnson: and doing certain types of sampling groundwater sample doing awkward for tests things that that I just didn't have opportunities to do that, and that was stuff that I learned.
Eric Johnson: In my professional career working with other more experienced geologists hydrogeologist to essentially taught me how to do those types of activities and that type of work.
Eric Johnson: In addition to maybe hoping to short course or maybe using other I guess ways of increasing your knowledge base and skills and stuff like that so it's a little bit of a mix and also attending meetings like GSA and other stuff like that that definitely helped so it's kind of a mix.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Great Thank you very much, I appreciate that so Jim What about you how much has your.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: educational background helped you in the job that you currently have.
13345468004: I have to concur with Eric about third you know I just came out and knowing the fundamentals.
13345468004: And geoscience and then you know, the state of Alabama said okay here's what you really need to know, and they would send me and my colleagues to various workshops short courses and and even in house training, you know to learn regulations learn all the regulatory.
13345468004: aspects of the job because that was the most important and then.
13345468004: You would get a smattering of.
13345468004: Training from EPA Department of Energy on say.
13345468004: sampling protocols.
13345468004: We did you know.
13345468004: I took you know they will tell you know if you if you came into our program and you would never studied hydro geology.
13345468004: You know the a damn will send you to a couple of special classes on on groundwater they're they're basically to respond.
13345468004: Courses I think one's called the princeton course and I can't remember what the other one was but yeah cars biology and you know you'll you'll learn the rudiments of that there but they but.
13345468004: It where I work it's just mostly you know you know learn the regs learn the nature of.
13345468004: Your record circle BP familiar with those requirements.
13345468004: And then you know I never really did any.
13345468004: The geology that I learned as an undergraduate it's way different from a.
13345468004: Probably less science more science policy related things and then.
13345468004: Eventually, as I progress in my career, I got saddled with rewriting.
13345468004: got into manuals and technical manuals things like that.
13345468004: But yeah you know.
13345468004: You know it's like you know state government here it's probably a lot like private will teach you what we need to learn and and.
13345468004: You know.
13345468004: You know if you know if you if you, you know, if you like, that great.
13345468004: That being said, I do go out on my own and keep up with my own continuing, as you know, in geosciences.
13345468004: Coming up meetings like this, give me a little more latitude I can sit in on sessions workshops things that are more mature man my interests.
13345468004: always be learning that's my that's my that's one.
Recommendation I can make.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: that's a great tip Jim Thank you, what about you Randy.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Have you been using everything you've learned.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: In academia, I would think more so, but.
13345468004: yeah definitely more.
Randy Kath: So it is interesting because you know as as Jim and Eric have said is your academic education is really your foundation and you're going to get out you're going to learn things based on that foundation, so you really want that foundation to be an inch deep and a mile wide.
Randy Kath: Many companies consulting companies to think if you have a PhD or to specialized and I ended up with a Masters and PhD and quantitative metamorphic metrology, which is very specialized.
Randy Kath: But immediately when I started working assertive do instructional geology and mapping and understanding or bodies and our systems, so you learn that.
Randy Kath: But to take structural geology as an undergrad and get all that, and then I going into consulting you know just having that foundation, even though i'd never did engineering geology.
Randy Kath: I taught myself soil mechanics.
Randy Kath: and mechanics and started doing kinematic analysis of rock slopes for highway cuts and so you just learn it on the job, and you just as long as you're willing to.
Randy Kath: keep an open mind and put some extra effort outside of your job at home and on the weekends and build up your skill set.
Randy Kath: For each one of your projects, well then, I went to work at the university after working in gold exploration and consulting.
Randy Kath: And my backgrounds and metamorphic metrology and why don't teach metamorphic geology I teach structural geology engineering geology and economic geology which is really from my days working at homestay can golder.
Randy Kath: So I built up that foundation and that's what got me the position at the university was the structure and economic portion of it, so do good and get that Foundation and the rest of it you'll learn on the job.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Excellent Thank you and we are a small group i'll just say again, students, if you want to ask a question, you can unmute yourself, you can type it in the chat you're welcome to do that.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: But why don't we go ahead i'll move to our last question, which is one I always like to end on, so what hard career lessons have you learned that if you could go back and start over you would do differently and i'll start with Randy I see staring up at the ceiling.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: And then i'll work my way down to.
Eric.
Randy Kath: Well Jennifer i'm going to say I don't think I have a really hard lesson that I would I would do differently.
Randy Kath: i've been with my career path.
Randy Kath: it's been very varied and having a when I left consulting and went into teaching I thought, if I taught the same thing every semester for 20 years i'd get stale.
Randy Kath: I keep changing my classes keep doing consulting on the side so i'm pretty happy with the decisions that i've made I don't think i'd go back and change anything.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Like I fall and do you know that's the first time i've heard that answer that's really great to hear that's wonderful.
13345468004: What about you, Jim any hard.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Lessons that you would do differently if you could look back you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: talk to your former young.
Self.
13345468004: But I tell my young so who.
13345468004: Start networking more more aggressively.
13345468004: I I really didn't develop a network until maybe a decade ago.
13345468004: If I had started earlier, you know I think I would have I would have benefited from that maybe.
13345468004: You know, maybe as soon as I graduated from from college.
13345468004: That that would be something I would pass on to.
13345468004: To the.
13345468004: Any anybody who's an early career professional it does make a difference, your references, you know, the more you can get the better off you'll be.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: that's helpful every major job i've ever had has all been through networking it's really made a really big difference to my career so i'll second that myself.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: What about you Eric if you could you know any hard lessons that you've learned or advice you'd give to yourself, when you were just starting out if you could.
Eric Johnson: Definitely third the the networking recommendation that Jim and you had again I think that's very, very important, and whether you do that in person, using something like linkedin or whatever notes on whatever platform, the truth.
Eric Johnson: is very, very helpful and very rich.
Eric Johnson: or the other thing I would say is keep an open mind.
Eric Johnson: With things, and you know if you see opportunities to do, maybe different things considered it not saying you have to dive into it, but definitely I think you will look to see because the environmental field as your gym and Raven mentioned it covers a lot of areas there's a lot to it.
13345468004: And there you might have opportunities to.
Eric Johnson: Do different things.
Eric Johnson: Whether it's your maybe as an internship when you're still in school or maybe afterwards and you start to get out in your professional career, you may want to work on something.
Eric Johnson: For that, but then.
Eric Johnson: You may want to start to do some work, maybe, if you want to stay in the private sector doing more water resources related work so see an opportunity there may be fine you're still young.
Eric Johnson: Because I think you get to maybe see a lot of different areas where you might be able to use your skills.
Eric Johnson: geological skills and knowledge and then maybe started to focus in on something that you really love that you really, really like I really liked the way around water response, I really like doing modeling around water models that are related offenses and then maybe try to adjust your.
Eric Johnson: Your career professions.
Eric Johnson: To those areas that are area that you really like I just pretty much stay doing the same thing about my professional career and I wish, maybe, looking back and maybe seek out maybe doing some other things, when I was young.
Eric Johnson: Rather than just kind of staying doing environmental.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Excellent Thank you.
13345468004: yeah.
Please do.
13345468004: um yeah I concur with Eric.
13345468004: You know gosh over a decade ago, I want to learn to write policy.
13345468004: But there were no opportunities here, where I work, so I joined a committee at GSA and spent three years working on things like decision statements and White Papers and.
13345468004: yeah I went in there, knowing absolutely nothing, and when I was done, I came out.
13345468004: With a whole different skill set in terms of editing and writing and being able to communicate.
13345468004: highly technical issues to a to the light public and.
13345468004: I really benefited from that and I actually found a new interest you know and that's something that I get to pursue a little bit here and a mom, but if you have opportunities like that thanks that maybe you're even mildly interested in I said go ahead and.
13345468004: Try and try and pursue it it'll you know it'll probably help you grow as a professional.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: that's a great tip I like that a lot any other parting words that any of you would like to offer Randy jammer Eric.
Randy Kath: Jennifer I just put in the chat that.
Randy Kath: If if any of the students have any questions or need information about licensure or wanting to discuss anything that we talked about today feel free to call me that there's my university phone number and my email so i'd be more than happy to talk to you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Wonderful Thank you and for all the students remember as you've heard here multiple times networking is a really important part of your career and so you've had a chance to meet these individuals so make sure you grab their contact info and if you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: have questions certainly follow.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Up later.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Any other.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: comments or questions from our students.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: or Jim you're welcome to comment as well, I apologize.
13345468004: Oh.
13345468004: yeah, you have my my email contact on feel free to drop me a line and i'll be happy to.
13345468004: offer you whatever whatever advice I have.
13345468004: And I will make one recommendation of perseverance, I think, is is kind of the key.
13345468004: To getting a job as well you know if.
13345468004: You know, it can take a while, particularly and.
13345468004: recessionary times, but if you keep plugging away, you know eventually you'll land that first job and from there, you know you'll you'll move forward.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Excellent Thank you very much, well we're a small group so in the session start again in 15 minutes, so this is a nice chance for you to have a few minutes to grab some water before you get going again.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thank you very much Randy and.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: I you just popped in to see how we were doing and I grabbed you and you hung out, and I really appreciate that and Jim and Eric Thank you so much for volunteering your time.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: We really appreciate it very much.
I hope you have a wonderful.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Thank you so much, everyone Thank you have a great day and a.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: Good rest of the meeting.
Eric Johnson: Thank you.
RISE Jennifer Nocerino: bye. RISE Jennifer Nocerino: bye.